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Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 06:03
This rant was written for the Wharton Undergraduate Journal.

Ode to the Nice Guys

This is a tribute to the nice guys. The nice guys that finish last, that never become more than friends, that endure hours of whining and bitching about what assholes guys are, while disproving the very point. This is dedicated to those guys who always provide a shoulder to lean on but restrain themselves to tentative hugs, those guys who hold open doors and give reassuring pats on the back and sit patiently outside the changing room at department stores. This is in honor of the guys that obligingly reiterate how cute/beautiful/smart/funny/sexy their female friends are at the appropriate moment, because they know most girls need that litany of support. This is in honor of the guys with open minds, with laid-back attitudes, with honest concern. This is in honor of the guys who respect a girls every facet, from her privacy to her theology to her clothing style.

This is for the guys who escort their drunk, bewildered female friends back from parties and never take advantage once they're at her door, for the guys who accompany girls to bars as buffers against the rest of the creepy male population, for the guys who know a girl is fishing for compliments but give them out anyway, for the guys who always play by the rules in a game where the rules favor cheaters, for the guys who are accredited as boyfriend material but somehow don't end up being boyfriends, for all the nice guys who are overlooked, underestimated, and unappreciated, for all the nice guys who are manipulated, misled, and unjustly abandoned, this is for you.

This is for that time she left 40 urgent messages on your cell phone, and when you called her back, she spent three hours painstakingly dissecting two sentences her boyfriend said to her over dinner. And even though you thought her boyfriend was a chump and a jerk, you assured her that it was all ok and she shouldn't worry about it. This is for that time she interrupted the best killing spree you'd ever orchestrated in GTA3 to rant about a rumor that romantically linked her and the guy she thinks is the most repulsive person in the world. And even though you thought it was immature and you had nothing against the guy, you paused the game for two hours and helped her concoct a counter-rumor to spread around the floor. This is also for that time she didn't have a date, so after numerous vows that there was nothing serious between the two of you, she dragged you to a party where you knew nobody, the beer was awful, and she flirted shamelessly with you, justifying each fit of reckless teasing by announcing to everyone: "oh, but we're just friends!" And even though you were invited purely as a symbolic warm body for her ego, you went anyways. Because you're nice like that.

The nice guys don't often get credit where credit is due. And perhaps more disturbing, the nice guys don't seem to get laid as often as they should. And I wish I could logically explain this trend, but I can't. From what I have observed on campus and what I have learned from talking to friends at other schools and in the workplace, the only conclusion I can form is that many girls are just illogical, manipulative bitches. Many of them claim they just want to date a nice guy, but when presented with such a specimen, they say irrational, confusing things such as "Oh, he's too nice to date." or "He would be a good boyfriend but he's not for me." or "He already puts up with so much from me, I couldn't possibly ask him out!" or the most frustrating of all: "No, it would ruin our friendship." Yet, they continue to lament the lack of datable men in the world, and they expect their too-nice-to-date male friends to sympathize and apologize for the men that are jerks. Sorry, guys, girls like that are beyond my ability to fathom. I can't figure out why the connection breaks down between what they say (I want a nice guy!) and what they do (I'm going to sleep with this complete ass nowhttp://img231.imageshack.us/img231/8956/doggy5vc.gif (http://imageshack.us)!). But one thing I can do, is say that the nice-guy-finishes-last phenomenon doesn't last forever. There are definitely many girls who grow out of that train of thought and realize they should be dating the nice guys, not taking them for granted. The tricky part is finding those girls, and even trickier, finding the ones that are single.

So, until those girls are found, I propose a toast to all the nice guys. You know who you are, and I know you're sick of hearing yourself described as ubiquitously nice. But the truth of the matter is, the world needs your patience in the department store, your holding open of doors, your party escorting services, your propensity to be a sucker for a pretty smile. For all the crazy, inane, absurd things you tolerate, for all the situations where you are the faceless, nameless hero, my accolades, my acknowledgement, and my gratitude go out to you. You do have credibility in this society, and your well deserved vindication is coming.

I must say this is probably one of the biggest truths unsaid or unnoticed in society. :o

Ode to the Nice Girls: Version 1

This is a tribute to the nice girls. These are the girls who are safe. The girls whom guys who have girlfriends are allowed to hang out with because they’re not viewed as a threat. These are the girls who dress respectably . . . they don’t go and get “skank clothes” and parade themselves around, catching the attention of every drooling, testosterone-filled boy on earth. These are the girls who are okay with going to chick-fil-a on a date, hanging out, watching a movie, playing a game, or doing some other low-cost, high-fun form of entertainment. Because after all, it’s really about the quality time that they spend with the guy and not the amount of money that is flowing from his pockets in order to please her every whim and desire (or so he thinks) during the date.

This is in honor of the girls who take the time to ask their guy friends “how’s life?” and to listen carefully when the answer is given. The girls who go out of their way to make cookies or cheer up male friends in distress. Yeah, we know “men are from Mars” and “women are from Venus,” but a simple “thank you” is pretty darn universal.

This goes out to the girls who must sit complacently while their guy friends discuss the “hotness” of the girl at the next table over. They watch as these guys date or lust over each and every self-centered, trashy, insecure, flirtatious, and flighty girl they come into contact with.

When asked, most guys say they would like to date a nice girl. However, when faced with such an opportunity, they claim that “I love her . . .like a little sister” or “there are no such things as nice girls. They’re all evil.” These guys continue to complain about how all girls are “manipulative” and “gossipy” and wonder why in the world they all go to the bathroom at the same time.

But, we must confess, there are guys out there who realize the value of their nice friends who are girls. These are the guys who should be praised for their willingness to go with the flow, hang out, and chill. These guys, however, fail to consider these nice girls as anything more than friends or to step up to the plate and consider them for a Saturday night date or the upcoming dance even though they possess all the qualities that guys claim they are looking for. But, a note to the nice girls. Eventually all guys will (or at least should) realize that they don’t want to have a relationship with a girl who wants all of their money and who will only date them until a guy who is better or more enhancing for her social status comes along. So, until those guys realize what is right in front of them, a word of encouragement to the nice girls. You know who you are, and I know you’re sick of being treated like a doormat. In all honesty, you are valuable. Clearly, you possess qualities that cause your guy friends to want to hang out with you. The world needs your encouragement, your willingness to take part in spontaneous activities, your ability to continue to enjoy life even though you watch as countless nasty, malicious female sirens blind the nice guys with their alluring ways. For all of the random, frustrating, and seemingly non-sensical things you tolerate, don’t lose hope. Nice guys do exist and will someday realize that nice girls, who are not evil, exist as well. Fear not, your day will come. And perhaps your prince will too.

Ode to the Nice Girls: Version 2

This is my tribute to the nice girls. To the nice girls who are overlooked, who become friends and nothing more, who spend hours fixating upon their looks and their personalities and their actions because it must be they that are doing something wrong. This is for the girls who don't give it up on the first date, who don't want to play mind games, who provide a comforting hug and a supportive audience for a story they've heard a thousand times. This is for the girls who understand that they aren't perfect and that the guys they're interested in aren't either, for the girls who flirt and laugh and worry and obsess over the slightest glance, whisper, touch, because somehow they are able to keep alive that hope that maybe... maybe this time he'll have understood. This is an homage to the girls who laugh loud and often, who are comfortable in skirts and sweats and combat boots, who care more than they should for guys who don't deserve their attention. This is for those girls who have been in the trenches, who have watched other girls time and time again fake up and make up and fuck up the guys in their lives without saying a word. This is for the girls who have been there from the beginning and have heard the trite words of advice, from "there are plenty of fish in the sea," to "time heals all wounds." This is to honor those girls who know that guys are just as scared as they are, who know that they deserve better, who are seeking to find it.

This is for the girls who have never been in love, but know that it's an experience that they don't want to miss out on. For the girls who have sought a night with friends and been greeted by a night of catcalling, rude comments and explicit invitations that they'd rather not have experienced. This is for the girls who have spent their weekends sitting on the sidelines of a beer pong tournament or a case race, or playing Florence Nightingale for a vomiting guy friend or a comatose crush, who have received a drunk phone call just before dawn from someone who doesn't care enough to invite them over but is still willing to pass out in their bed. This is for the girls who have left sad song lyrics in their away messages, who have tried to make someone understand through a subliminally appealing profile, who have time and time again dropped their male friend hint after hint after hint only to watch him chase after the first blonde girl in a skirt. This is for the girls who have been told that they're too good or too smart or too pretty, who have been given compliments as a way of breaking off a relationship, who have ever been told they are only wanted as a friend.

This one's for the girls who you can take home to mom, but won't because it's easier to sleep with a whore than foster a relationship; this is for the girls who have been led on by words and kisses and touches, all of which were either only true for the moment, or never real to begin with. This is for the girls who have allowed a guy into their head and heart and bed, only to discover that he's just not ready, he's just not over her, he's just not looking to be tied down; this is for the girls who believe the excuses because it's easier to believe that it's not that they don't want you, it's that they don't want anyone. This is for the girls who have had their hearts broken and their hopes dashed by someone too cavalier to have cared in the first place; this is for the nights spent dissecting every word and syllable and inflection in his speech, for the nights when you've returned home alone, for the nights when you've seen from across the room him leaning a little too close, or standing a little too near, or talking a little too softly for the girl he's with to be a random hookup. This is for the girls who have endured party after party in his presence, finally having realized that it wasn't that he didn't want a relationship: it was that he didn't want you. I honor you for the night his dog died or his grandmother died or his little brother crashed his car and you held him, thinking that if you only comforted him just right, or said the right words, or rubbed his back in the right way then perhaps he'd realize what it was that he already had. This is for the night you realized that it would never happen, and the sunrise you saw the next morning after failing to sleep.

This is for the "I really like you, so let's still be friends" comment after you read more into a situation than he ever intended; this is for never realizing that when you choose friends, you seldom choose those which make you cry yourself to sleep. This is for the hugs you've received from your female friends, for the nights they've reassured you that you are beautiful and intelligent and amazing and loyal and truly worthy of a great guy; this is for the despair you all felt as you sat in the aftermath of your tears, knowing that that night the only companionship you'd have was with a pillow and your teddy bear. This is for the girls who have been used and abused, who have endured what he was giving because at least he was giving something; this is for the stupidity of the nights we've believed that something was better than nothing, though his something was nothing we'd have ever wanted. This is for the girls who have been satisified with too little and who have learned never to expect anything more: for the girls who don't think that they deserve more, because they've been conditioned for so long to accept the scraps thrown to them by guys.

This is what I don't understand. Men sit and question and whine that girls are only attracted to the mean guys, the guys who berate them and belittle them and don't appreciate them and don't want them; who use them for sex and think of little else than where their next conquest will be made. Men complain that they never meet nice girls, girls who are genuinely interested and compelling, who are intelligent and sweet and smart and beautiful; men despair that no good women want to share in their lives, that girls play mindgames, that girls love to keep them hanging. Yet, men, I ask you: were you to meet one of these genuinely interested, thrillingly compelling, interesting and intelligent and sweet and beautiful and smart girls, were you to give her your number and wait for her to call... and if you were to receive a call from her the next day and she, in her truthful, loyal, intelligent and straightforward nice girl fashion, were to tell you that she finds you intriguing and attractive and interesting and worth her time and perhaps material from which she could fashion a boyfriend, would you or would you not immediately call your friends to tell them of the "stalker chick" you'd met the night prior, who called you and wore her heart on her sleeve and told the truth? And would you, or would you not, refuse to make plans with her, speak with her, see her again, and once again return to the bar or club or party scene and search once more for this "nice girl" who you just cannot seem to find? Because therein lies the truth, guys: we nice girls are everywhere. But you're not looking for a nice girl. You're not looking for someone genuinely interested in your intermural basketball game, or your anatomy midterm grade, or that argument you keep having with your father; you're looking for a quick fix, a night when you can pretend to have a connection with another human being which is just as disposable as the condom you were using during it.

So don't say you're on the lookout for nice girls, guys, when you pass us up on every step you take. Sometimes we go undercover; sometimes we go in disguise: sometimes when that girl in the low cut shirt or the too tight miniskirt won't answer your catcalls, sometimes you're looking at a nice girl in whore's clothing - - we might say we like the attention, we might blush and giggle and turn back to our friends, but we're all thinking the same thing: "This isn't me. Tomorrow morning, I'll be wearing a teeshirt and flannel shorts, I'll have slept alone and I'll be making my hungover best friend breakfast. See through the disguise. See me." You never do. Why? Because you only see the exterior, you only see the slutty girl who welcomes those advances. You don't want the nice girl.. so don't say you're looking for a relationship: relationships take time and energy and intent, three things we're willing to extend - - but in return, we're looking for compassion and loyalty and trust, three things you never seem willing to express. Maybe nice guys finish last, but in the race they're running they're chasing after the whores and the sluts and the easy-targets... the nice girls are waiting at the finish line with water and towels and a congradulatory hug (and yes, if she's a nice girl and she likes you, the sweatiness probably won't matter), hoping against hope that maybe you'll realize that they're the ones that you want at the end of that silly race.

So maybe it won't last forever. Maybe some of those guys in that race will turn in their running shoes and make their way to the concession stand where we're waiting; however, until that happens, we still have each other, that silly race to watch, and all the chocolate we can eat (because what's a concession stand at a race without some chocolate?)
Ladies, you're not alone. :wink:

Ron V.
24th July 2005, 06:14
I really envy guys that can be a total jerk and not mind at all. It really looks like fun.

Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 06:18
Aren't you like that? I can't imagine being that way either.

Ron V.
24th July 2005, 06:40
Aren't you like that? I can't imagine being that way either.
Aren't I like a total jerk?

mot
24th July 2005, 06:46
If I had any female friends, I'd be one of those guys. Their loss I guess!

Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 06:56
Aren't you like that? I can't imagine being that way either.
Aren't I like a total jerk?
Just a little bit at least. One cannot be totally jerk-free unless you really are.

Ron V.
24th July 2005, 07:16
Did I do something jerkish?

Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 07:18
Sort of, the ones you can remember.

Ron V.
24th July 2005, 07:58
Sort of, the ones you can remember.
But they told me what happens in Paris stays in Paris.

What? That's only Vegas? Alright then, you win.

mot
24th July 2005, 08:04
Amazing how this topic got flipped over after 2 posts!

Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 16:05
Okay back to topic. Are you one of the nice guys who aren't given the proper recognition as said above?

SeeMeRot
24th July 2005, 19:21
true........nice guys never get recognition.......but it's their fault.....if u really want something/someone......u've gotta be agressive about it.......if not?.....here comes the friendmode (again) .....I have no sympathy for em......they've seen how the "jerks" do it......so they know what they have to do.....

Melodramatic
24th July 2005, 19:28
^ That would imply girls as emotional masochists, which subtley seems to be the case.

loff
25th July 2005, 04:09
Sounds like me alright.. *toasts with mot*

Emmerdale001
25th July 2005, 06:44
Girls like a little danger and some tension for some reason, so they go for the bad guys, but if you'll note, do you want some of the kinds of girls these bad guys attract? Sure, they may be great for sex, and for some of us, that's enough :twisted:, and they may be fantastically beautiful, but they can offer little for relationships, which might be one reason (out of a list of several) bad guys go through so many of these girls.

I note a lot of girls where I live are spoiled by their own good looks, and I find it to be the greatest joke of all time. It's easy to find a girl that's beautiful on the outside, but is it so easy to find a girl who is not only fantastically beautiful on the outside but also beautiful on the inside? Ever find a fantastically beautiful girl who wasn't spoiled by her own good looks? If you do, you've found a keeper.

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 06:57
You're one of the bad guys aren't ya Em? :twisted:

Quentin
25th July 2005, 07:15
All of your questions in that post can be answered here"

http://www.intellectualwhores.com

and

http://www.nomarriage.com

Happy reading.

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 07:24
^ Haha! i've already read that Quent. A good read I must say. But what's your personal take on it. Are nice guys really doomed or do they just seem that way because they're with the wrong women.

Quentin
25th July 2005, 07:55
I am a nice guy believe it or not. But how do I get dates?

I can simply answer this by saying... I never get too close to them, at the same time I never give them what 100 kabazillion other guys give them.

specific types of attention, namely - "I think you are hot" attention

Let me tell you about this time I was at a restaurant and I mistakenly gave out the wrong signals.

my friend and I went to eat, he ordered alcohol, and I ordered a pepsi.
The "female bartender" asked me "You don't want a drink?" I said I am getting a drink and its pepsi.

She served me the drink. After I polished off the pepsi, she asked again, if I wanted alcohol, politely I said pepsi is fine.

my friend and I started to talk about her hotness factor and I was like,... yeah but there are hundreds of girls out there she would have to compete with. Well she over heard it, or atleast part of it. She confronted me by saying.. Hundreds of what? I snapped back in a jokingly manor.. and Nunya...

"What is nunya?" she pondered... I quickly replied "Nunya- business."

she laughed.. later.. she offered me another alcoholic beverage and I said without skipping a beat... "Look, you can't just get me drunk and take advantage of me like that..."

Her reply was "I don't know.. I get off in about a half-hour."

I had no intention of taking her out that night... yet for some reason.. I gave her those signals... it was just funny.

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 08:02
Strange indeed. Bar people have this secret lingo. It's fascinating. So ye haven't taken a woman home since your wife, eh?

Quentin
25th July 2005, 08:03
I have taken women out... just not home... and the reason... I want to keep my money and freedom. (in a nutshell)

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 08:14
I have taken women out... just not home... and the reason... I want to keep my money and freedom. (in a nutshell)
Wel you did mention you haven't slept with anyone since your ex-wife. Or I must be in error.

Emmerdale001
25th July 2005, 09:27
Noooo, If anything, I do NOT fall under the category of "bad guy." I was always the less talkative type in high school. I only am more socialable when I'm around people I know, and frankly, at this point in my life, there's very, very few people I see often anymore. I am probably more socially reclusive than average.

Soft and quiet would be terms that describe me in my natural state. I can do "fun," but that's not an everyday thing with me. I'm not exactly in the same social circles with the girls who like the bad guys, and I never was despite some invitations.

loff
25th July 2005, 10:41
"Ever find a fantastically beautiful girl who wasn't spoiled by her own good looks? If you do, you've found a keeper." Guess who blew it ^_^

Quentin
25th July 2005, 17:41
@Melodramatic: You are correct in that, I haven't.. taking someone out and sleeping with them are two different things.


And you can only screw up with someone if you are trying.

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 20:56
^ What made you come to that decision Quent? I have divorced male friends & boy did they love the freedom & availability of fresh meat to play with.

Quentin
25th July 2005, 21:28
With sex comes the possibility of disease, even if contraceptives are used, you can never be 100% protected, besides, I have more important things to worry about than sex.

Melodramatic
25th July 2005, 21:48
Ahh so true to the core as always. Very wise you are Quent. :idea:

Quentin
26th July 2005, 01:51
i wouldn't say wise... but rather, aware. That is one of my worst fears, contracting an STD... or even AIDS.

Melodramatic
26th July 2005, 02:27
^ yep. studies have confirmed rubber don't protect against HPV. Ugh that's soo gross.

Back on track: Guys there's new material for the girls. Give your input on it if you've met one of these "nice girls" you didn't mean to overlook.

Ramon_Morales_Jr
26th July 2005, 03:18
doing the dew is fun

PayBays
26th July 2005, 03:29
I'm always a nice guy.If my girlfriends are drunk i won't kiss them or licking them you know

friendship is important for me

Quentin
26th July 2005, 04:26
I wont kiss my friends that are girls... But I have licked one on the cheek, real wet like and she was like ewwww... it was utterly funny and she called me a brat. The only bad think about that was her makeup didn't taste good.

Ludicrous Maximus
26th July 2005, 09:08
Excellent thread! It's so damn true!

Melodramatic
27th July 2005, 20:27
Excellent thread! It's so damn true!
Are you one of the nice guys?

Melodramatic
29th July 2005, 02:51
All of your questions in that post can be answered here"

http://www.intellectualwhores.com

and

http://www.nomarriage.com

Happy reading.
But you're forgetting 2 more sites of the same nature Quent.

http://www.the-niceguy.com/

and

http://www.ihatewomen.com/

tern
29th July 2005, 04:53
That is basically true. Though I have problem for another reason. Throughout high school I'd start going out with girls and I then I'd just kill the relationship. It's like I knew that there was no way I'd marry them, so spend the money or time? Better just to be friends with them, and worry about dating and serious relationships later. :bounce:

Ludicrous Maximus
29th July 2005, 09:51
Are you one of the nice guys?

I'm affraid I am. When my friends are too bored to get out shopping with their girlfriends, it happened I did the dirty job for them (waiting so much in shops, seeing an 1m55 tall girl trying many sort of short dress and having to tell her they weren't good enough when I could have just told her she is too small to wear those and save so much time).

Or whatever, having a girl crying next to me after a dispute and having her getting better to get back to bed with her dude in the minutes following.

I'll spare you the examples lol.

Melodramatic
29th July 2005, 18:40
Oh Lud. Remember, it's always the nice guys who're ensnared by the wrong girls. Can't keep doing that, though. Otherwise you'd be nothing more than a doormat & that is something you don't want.

Ludicrous Maximus
1st August 2005, 23:20
Yeah, I'm just out of fixing her computer because she had something like 361 spywares and shits on.....

Now her internet is working again, her computer is fast and it can read DVDs again......


And I end up alone again.

Melodramatic
2nd August 2005, 02:08
Oh man. Let her bf clean her mess. otherwise, tell her to run off with you.

loff
8th August 2005, 13:03
I'll up this. Does anyone know who wrote these (mostly the first one)?

Melodramatic
8th August 2005, 22:50
I think it's a very educated girl who came to a realization about this unfair ordeal that affects the nice guys.

Quentin
9th August 2005, 01:04
They all do Melo.. but instead of doing the nice thing and trying to change / accomodate, they figure out how to exploit it to their gain.

Its the ones that are aware of morality that seem to know what to do, how to behave and most of be a friend in return.

I'd like to think that if I were attracted to one of my "girl" friends, that they would come around, it would take - what I like to call "A hollywood moment".

What is a hollywood moment? Go watch "My date with Tad Hamelton" or "Trojan Wars" There are soo many movies out there like this that you can litterally see these hollywood moments happen to the girls and they come around.

Think about it.

Melodramatic
9th August 2005, 01:20
You mean a big disappointment to occur?

Quentin
9th August 2005, 05:24
basically every girl out there, unless retarded, learns at a very young age, (In America) that nice guys will give... at this point, they decide to either A: learn to subtly exploit it, or B: recongnize it and unless they want the guy, refuse to accept any favorities from them.

its that simple.

Jukkaaa
9th January 2007, 16:32
I haven't read so true words for some time.

Was just wondering what makes the nice guys nice guys?

Señor Villa
10th January 2007, 06:05
I haven't read so true words for some time.

Was just wondering what makes the nice guys nice guys?

Nice guys get whipped by women and nice girls are a challenge so just get them drunk and they will loosen up. :cheesy:

william hall
12th January 2007, 15:32
Not all girls are the same, there are some nice girls around, i should know i married one, she gives me a hard time occasionally but only when i deserve it. Just have to make sure she doesn't see this she might think i am turning soft. :lol:

Eril
12th January 2007, 15:45
:arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :? Whatever....

william hall
12th January 2007, 16:05
:arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :? Whatever.... If it bores you so much don't read it, or don't reply, but then again you reply to everything.

Señor Villa
13th January 2007, 04:18
Not all girls are the same, there are some nice girls around, i should know i married one, she gives me a hard time occasionally but only when i deserve it. Just have to make sure she doesn't see this she might think i am turning soft. :lol:

How long have you been married, William Hall?

Eril
13th January 2007, 06:38
:arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :? Whatever.... If it bores you so much don't read it, or don't reply, but then again you reply to everything.

Sorry if I offened you or some other guy here, in fact to many words I can say to this topic but something stop me. anyway have a nice days.

william hall
13th January 2007, 13:30
Ok Eril, no problem :wink: @ Senor Villa, 10 years this year, i can't believe it, makes me feel so old.

Señor Villa
13th January 2007, 19:00
Ok Eril, no problem :wink: @ Senor Villa, 10 years this year, i can't believe it, makes me feel so old.

10 years that is pretty damn good. Not too many last that long in our generation. Congrats :wink: