Terror Attacks Hit London

[Broken Wings]

LONDON - Four blasts rocked the London subway and tore open a packed double-decker bus during the morning rush hour Thursday, sending bloodied victims fleeing in the worst attack on London since World War II. At least 40 people were killed, U.S. officials said, and more than 390 wounded in the terror attacks.

They have found out that this was an Islamic Terrorist Attack.

[DavidAlizée]

Actually there are 700+ injured in the attack. I guess the underground is not safe anymore. President Bush has flew down from Scotland to be with Blair. Ive been to London alot, but everytime i go their, i always fear something like this happens. The ammount of bomb scares in that place is crazy anyway. Yet, The Police have targeted so many islamic groups in the past year, that were plotting attacks in London. It is a shame indeed, these people are the reason the world is in such a state, and to be honest.. It takes the whole meaning of religion and throws it out of the water.

It is a grave shame on those people that lost thier lives, and the mess it has caused.

[Broken Wings]

I agree. im so sorry that had to happen. those fucks are going to pay. Well I guess there is a good reason we are still fighting those Terroritsts

[DavidAlizée]

^ very true. They have just added to fuel to a raging fire. They just don't know it yet. Oh, i forgot to mention.. the mayor of NewYork, that was having is lunch or something, when the twin towers came down.. he was also walking past the street when it happened. Poor guy.

[AlizéeInMYHeart]

I have heard that there has been 37 confirmed deaths, and 700+ injured, but that the death number will still rise when they have confirmed how many died in the doubledecker explosion.

I've been watching on BBC and CNN for 5-6 hours straight now...it's a really terrible sight, That bus that has had the entire upper floor blown to pieces, an all those witnesses statements on how they have had to walk over bodies in the subway :cry:

[DavidAlizée]

AIMH, yep, im watching the same as you BBC.

I was talking to my mate, who might have lost some of his mates from uni, because his uni is near where it went off, and they all use the underground around that time.


My back yard-SaL says:
yo dave u seen the news
David of.. says:
yea, very bad
David of.. says:
you live in London dont ya?
My back yard-SaL says:
yes
David of.. says:
were you effected?
My back yard-SaL says:
total lockdown, no buses no trains running,
My back yard-SaL says:
mobile networks arnt working either
David of.. says:
damn, so are you in the thick of it? Did you see anything?
My back yard-SaL says:
nah, i woke up @ 1pm, lol
David of.. says:
hehe
David of.. says:
so the explosion didnt wake you up then ay
My back yard-SaL says:
they wernt that big
My back yard-SaL says:
could have been much worse
My back yard-SaL says:
i use those trains nearly everyday
David of.. says:
yeah true,. alot worse. So, are you pretty near to the the place where the bomb went off?
David of.. says:
yea, the underground got hit pretty hard
My back yard-SaL says:
londons splitinto zones, zone 1 being the city centre and zone 6 being the rural areas, i live in zone 3/4
David of.. says:
ah, so half n half
My back yard-SaL says:
yep
David of.. says:
well, glad ur still here to play aoc
David of.. says:
Regicide would suck withought you.
My back yard-SaL says:
i dunno how to feel, i may know some ppl that didnt make it
My back yard-SaL says:
lol@ regi
David of.. says:
really?
My back yard-SaL says:
yea, my uni is in moorgate
David of.. says:
like, mates online? or like.. ones you know from London?
David of.. says:
oh
David of.. says:
when will you find out?
My back yard-SaL says:
not today thats for sure
David of.. says:
Ah okay then, take care, n cya.. let me know anything else k
My back yard-Sal says:
on np, cya man

[AlizéeInMYHeart]

oh..that's terrible...and the bombs were detonated at a time when most were probably on the way to the uni I guess, some 8:50 AM, the first one, the one near Liverpool street...

[PayBays]

I hope my good friend is still alive.He lives somewhere in London.I haven't heard of him in 2 days,while he usually is always on MSN

man i'm really worried :cry: :cry: :cry:

[DavidAlizée]

yep, excatly. They seem to missread the koran, and act under false information. Religion is a key factor in these bombings. They believe they are doingd Gods will, when infact they are the opposite. In the bible it is clear, that there will be a false prophet that will lead his people in the name of God, and tells to stay away and look out for it. This is excatly what is happening.

The last time the bombings happened, every islam was badly beaten on every street around the UK. The sam will happen again, as long as they continue to have these little meetings in a town hall. I mean, i saw 20 muslims talling how great it was that the "heros" that crached the planes in NY, should be hailed. I mean, it is crazy. Something needs to be done, something big. We can't just sit America and England and whereever you may be , and wait for these attacks. America, Britian and everyone else, needs to do something about this, i mean it is going to happen again and again, even if Bin Laden is captured. As long as these muslins ( islams ) believe the things they have been taught in the koran, it is never going to end. Fathers teach their kids, kids grow up and become bombers, or murderes. The whole world is falling apart beacause of these crazy people and thier religion.

A full scale attack, is what is needed, no lives spared. The ling has been crossed, and its time to act before other countries suffer the same fate, like those did in NY, London and madrid.

Nuke the whole lot of them from orbit.

[PayBays]

DavidAlizée is right,

i always wanted to smack Bush in his face and rescue the people there in Irak.And then bomb them all.I hate things that are going this way,before you know you'll find a bomb under your bed.

Man this is going way to fast and voilently!

How much lives do there have to disappear,when people will see what the world is coming to!

[Darius]

This is terrible what those terrorists have done. All they achieved is increasing anger against them. :evil:

[PayBays]

Actually there are 700+ injured in the attack. I guess the underground is not safe anymore. President Bush has flew down from Scotland to be with Blair

**** Bush!He can't do anything about it.I hope that man trips his shoes and falls on his head again. :evil:

[UK Fan 2003]

All I can say is that my heart and thoughts are with those families who have lost loved-ones and to those who are still fighting for thier lives in hospital. No-one deserved this, no-one... :(

Why ? (the only question people here in the UK are asking)

:cry: :cry: :cry:

[Bondius]

Bush can't be held responsable for the attacks, PayBays. It began with 9/11 ... Bush took this as an oportunity to invade Iraq/Afganistan, all hell broke loose. I'm sorry for the lives of those in London but I'm also afraid of something like that here, in Romania. We aided the american troops, let them use our planes/airports, etc. We could be next on Al-Queda's revenge list. I wish it would all stop but untill there will be no more foreign troops in Iraq and Afganistan there's no chance. All we can do is pray ...

[PayBays]

I just f*cking hate this.I hope my friend isn't dead because of this bomb!

[Bondius]

Try to get in touch with him but don't be scared if you don't find him the first 2-3 days. Usualy panic makes people forget stuff like the PC.

[Petsku1]

yeah... it's horrible.



It seems there aint no place to be safe from the terrorists. Now London what next...?
that could be Helsinki some day if it continues like this, hmmh yea. :roll:

[DavidAlizée]

well, i can see it now. 5 years down the line, nothing will change, then about 15 years down the line, each country will make bigger and better bombs / nukes, untill we blow our own planet up. We will destroy ourselfs, thats for sure.

[Bondius]

Yes, I agree. World War 3 will be fought with nuclear weapons. World War 4 will be fought with sticks and stones. We can't afford a full scale nuke war ...

[Mr Bond]

Really horrible watching it unfold they showed some horrific pictures on tv here people just covered in blood. :cry: These people didn't do anything so many families ruined very sad. I thoughts must be with them.

[engin turk]

I curse those damn terrorists.As you can understand from my nickname (and my real name),i'm a Turk and Muslim.We also suffered from attacks of El-Kaide (Turkish name) in Istanbul in November 2003 and we lost our 27 citizens.Their target was English people in Istanbul,they bombed HSBC Bank and English Embassy,but most of deaths were Turkish people.

Because those terrorists are Muslim,and they ruin the image of Islam,and i hate this situation.The name of Islam is called now with terrorism.But none of Turkish people support these terrorist attacks.We suffered very much from terrorism for almost 20 years in East Anatolia and we lost more than 30000 people.I live in West and i've never lived those but i know.We are beside Londoners.

[MetalicGuy]

Okay this is my whole opinion about stuffs... well almost.. i will make it very short.. Before i hated Bush and so on.. and thought everything with the war against terrorism were junk.. But then they gained more and more of my support and this was like the "dot over the i" this is it.. something must be done! So i give my fully support to those who actually DARES to stand up and fight! And the task that has been given to especially Bush is very ungrateful. Yes of course they made some bad mistakes but at least they want to work for a change!

And yeah.. the world is pretty much fucked up right now.. But in the end of the tunnel i see a bright spot of light. Though.. a light islamic extremists won't ever see..

And about the nukes... i don't think it will ever be a nuclear war... at maximum 2-3 nukes dropped by "accident". Or terrorists that got hold of some nukes..

Then i want to say something about the islamic terrorist.. i mean... they are not following their god... they are taking the highway to hell.

I have nothing against muslims.. i have friends that are muslims.. but i must say.. don't take me wrong now.. and i think you'll have to agree... I myself wouldn't mind a world without muslim, it just would spare us so much trouble.. On the other hand i think many islamistic group thinks the same about us in the west. Okay that was a bit harsh.. my point is.. those islamic groups just pulls the rest of the muslim world to the dirt... and that's a big reason why i get those hostile feelings against muslims...

Okay.. call pac man if you want to get rid of all the "...." between the sentences...

And once again i want to assure you.. I'm not a racist!!!!!!

[DavidAlizée]

engin turk,

yeah, i understand what you are talking about, but man.. it is getting to the stage, where we don't care about if people support them or not, they need to be stopped.. one way or another.

Mutual respect has gone out of the window now, so i don't think anyone cares if people believe in their actions or not. No disrespect, but it is taking to far to filter out the good from the bad, its time for action.

I don't hate Bush, he did what needed to be done. If he had of sat back and did nothing, the towers would not be the only things that would been attacked. Things need to change, its not going to be pretty and its not going to be nice. Not everyone will agree with it, but tough luck. It's time for everyone to open their eyes, and lets end this war on terror, once and for all. Hit them wear it hurts.

what do muslims give to the world? Nothing, hate and war. What do they give to britian, we feed them, clothe them and look after them, and in turn they fuck us up. I would like to see a world withough muslins.

[engin turk]

Metalicguy,I think you should know Muslims are not just Islamic groups.95 percent of Turkish people are Muslim but there is no Islamic group in Turkey.

[MetalicGuy]

I mean.. if someone could make those islamic groups come to their senses.. And make them read the Koran correctly.. And that's why we should bring democracy to the middle-east.. to get more west influenced.. i think that would make a huge change... they are to conservative in some parts of the muslim world...

If everybody would have been like Turkey and some other countries.. omg.. what great world we would be living in...

The whole process takes time and patience.. but i think it will work out somehow in the end..

[engin turk]

You're right,it must be now stopped and it will be good for all of us.

[MetalicGuy]

I mean Turkey for example... have a huge profit on tourists... and i guess the relationship between the tourists and the turkish people made Turkey to what it is today. An example for the rest of the islamic world!

Maybe they should try get some tourists instead of nukes... (Iran for example)

[DavidAlizée]

Thing is metalic, even tho you are right. They COMPLETELY misread the Koran. It would be impossible to make them see this, and tell them to change thier faith in the koran. They are going 100% against the bible. At no stage does the bible say, to do Gods work.

A sorry end awaits the muslims, i tell ya.

The bible is clear on this, those who are lead by a false prophet, that will decieve people into thinking a religion will save them, watch out. For these will burn in fires of hell forever.

They can't and will not accept this fact. To be honest, there is no saving this world now, but we can make it decent to live in .., at least.

[MetalicGuy]

Remember one thing.. okay this is maybe a bit off-topic but anyway.... God made this world.. i don't think he have intentions to destroy it! Therefore it won't be any nuclear wars...

I believe countries are getting nukes just to scare others.. And it could be a war preventing strategy afterall... i mean.. who dares to attack a country who are threatening with nukes?

[engin turk]

It is not just the tourism made Turkey to what it is today.It is the development of Turkey what brought the huge profit of tourism to Turkey in fact.We hope to join the EU in 10-15 years,this is our development and it also develops our touristic potential.

[MetalicGuy]

It is not just the tourism made Turkey to what it is today.It is the development of Turkey what brought the huge profit of tourism to Turkey in fact.We hope to join the EU in 10-15 years,this is our development and it also develops our touristic potential.

yeye.. :P i'm not that much into it but anyway.. somehow the tourist is a part of the whole thing

[DavidAlizée]

well, he made the world, but he has showed us before, he won't interfear with human affairs. He didnt save his son on the cross who came to set us free, and look what we did to him. God won't destoy our world but humans will. Maybe not nukes, to be honest i don't fear them. Its the chemical weapons i fear. It is going to happen, sooner or later if they are not stopped.

When you look at the big picture, there is only one clear way to end this war on terror. Limit the numbers.., and there is only one way in doing that. Taking them all down. Not a nice thing to say, but we need to do something. We can't keep picking up the pieces of our contries. They are cowards to attack like this, they are nothing. They will soon be burning on earth, and in hell. Total cowards, that have no respect for any human life.

When there end is near, i hope their Koran is close at hand. :roll:

[engin turk]

You say tourist is a part,not the whole :D or i'm living in a different country. :wink:

[Mr Bond]

I hope it doesn't come to that metalic a situation like the Cold War with borth parties pointing nukes at each other causing panic but never actually using them.

[MetalicGuy]

You say tourist is a part,not the whole. :D Or i'm living in a different country. :wink:

Anyway.. i envy your tourism... we only get moose obsessed germans to sweden...

sorry.. off topic!!

[Mr Bond]

Surely the horror of Hiroshima should be enough to ensure no one uses nukes on a populated area.

[engin turk]

I also envy the tourism of Turkey,i live 400 km away from Mediterranean and i envy the local tourism of that region. 8)

[MetalicGuy]

well, he made the world, but he has showed us before, he won't interfear with human affairs. He didnt save his son on the cross who came to set us free, and look what we did to him. God won't destoy our world but humans will. Maybe not nukes, to be honest i don't fear them. Its the chemical weapons i fear. It is going to happen, sooner or later if they are not stopped.

I believe he allowed WWI and WWII to happen.. Just because he wanted to make people come to their senses.. That this is wrong... And i believe he gave power to those who were fighting to liberate europe.

I don't think he will allow us to destroy ourselves... i think he may interfere somehow... depression in economy for example... or natural disaster is another possibilty maybe... when people have other things in mind than fighting against each other.....

Or something else.. to have a common enemy... war against aliens or something.. it would make the worlds people united and stronger!

And yes.. i'm very much sci-fi influenced :P

[engin turk]

Surely the horror of Hiroshima should be enough to ensure no one uses nukes on a populated area.

It is quite big horror,knowing that 90000 died in seconds and totally were 130000 is very traggic.

[MetalicGuy]

Surely the horror of Hiroshima should be enough to ensure no one uses nukes on a populated area.

It is quite big horror,knowing that 90000 died in seconds and totally were 130000 is very traggic.

And there are bigger nukes now.... :cry:

[DavidAlizée]

well, he made the world, but he has showed us before, he won't interfear with human affairs. He didnt save his son on the cross who came to set us free, and look what we did to him. God won't destoy our world but humans will. Maybe not nukes, to be honest i don't fear them. Its the chemical weapons i fear. It is going to happen, sooner or later if they are not stopped.

I believe he allowed WWI and WWII to happen.. Just because he wanted to make people come to their senses.. That this is wrong... And i believe he gave power to those who were fighting to liberate europe.

I don't think he will allow us to destroy ourselves... i think he may interfere somehow... depression in economy for example... or natural disaster is another possibilty maybe... when people have other things in mind than fighting against each other.....

Or something else.. to have a common enemy... war against aliens or something.. it would make the worlds people united and stronger!

And yes.. i'm very much sci-fi influenced :P

Or, before we destroy ourselfs, he comes again.

He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead and also, the releations are clear on this. Might be a possible way. Regarding what you said aboiut the aliens, that would seem a logical way. To reunite the Human race. However, i think the muslims ( islamic ) are so evil, they will use that as another weakness to bomb countries.

Eitherway, in the old test, God flooded the earth because of this reason, well.. because of lack of respect for anyone. Things have got out of hand and , one of the biggest reason why people are racist today, is because of these attacks. Everyone is equal.. no expetions as we all stand in the light.

[Ayan]

When you look at the big picture, there is only one clear way to end this war on terror. Limit the numbers.., and there is only one way in doing that. Taking them all down. Not a nice thing to say, but we need to do something. We can't keep picking up the pieces of our contries. They are cowards to attack like this, they are nothing. They will soon be burning on earth, and in hell. Total cowards, that have no respect for any human life.

In the war of terror there are no winners or losers. There are only losers. Something like that was being said by an important smart guy but I forgot who exactly said it.

Who is a terrorist, the one who conquers a country and kills thousands or the one who kills hundreds in order to drive away the conquerors? The war is still going on, England as one of the main allies of USA should have expected that a long time ago.
I agree of course that killing civilians is terrible. Yet noone in UN will listen to Iraq people, such attacks are one of the few ways of gaining attention. Taking out a military object would have gotten them same kind of media attention and at the same time not make them look like cowards. But when the terrorism attack was indeed made by the muslims (and I am using that term very loosely here, no snaps please.) then their anger is somewhat understandable. And angry people are capable of doing things far worse.

We are not living in a black&white world.

Here a random link about the attack: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/news.php3?id=85346

[Manu]

I didn't know what happened till I got back home from class and saw the news in the evening, and it's really sad. Terrorism, wars, natural disasters or whatever making so many people suffer makes me feel so sad.

[DavidAlizée]

England did expect the attack, but it is impossible to detimine where abouts or how it is going to happen. Almsot every week, muslims are arrested for war crimes, or plotting attacks in Manchester/London. Yeah, it is a no win situation, anmd there are no winners or losers, but we can't sit back and wait for these attacks to happen, then think what to do. We need to stop them from happening, not just in America and Britian.. but all over the world. Why is it the same group all/most the time. They can not be allowed to get away with it.

[Manu]

This doesn't justify the war in Iraq, if that's what some of you mean. There are alternative ways to fight terrorism, if the war in Iraq ever fought against that and was a way to do it, which I very much doubt.

[Snatcher42]

Awful stuff. Condolences to victims and their families. To wake up to this news a few days after making travel plans to visit London this summer... terrible.

Maybe not nukes, to be honest i don't fear them. Its the chemical weapons i fear. It is going to happen, sooner or later if they are not stopped.
Chemical? Maybe, but it's biological weapons that scare the crap out of me. It's playing with fire, and I wouldn't be surprised if whoever ends up using them takes themselves out too, along with the rest of the human race.

Why is it the same group all/most the time.
But that group is al-Qaida, not "Muslims" like you keep saying. That's like blaming all Christians for the actions of the Ku Kuk Klan. I can't agree with this "Nuke em all" reaction... it's insane. After bombings by Corsican nationalists, no one thinks: "blow up the whole damn island!" The war on terror is about information: surgically rooting out and killing all traces al-Qaida like the weed it is.

Or something else.. to have a common enemy... war against aliens or something.. it would make the worlds people united and stronger!
Ever read Watchmen by Alan Moore? There, one of the characters actually "fakes" a deadly alien attack on New York to avert a third world war (though he certainly doesn't fake the deadly part... millions perish). It's an interesting idea... and a big moral dilemma if he did the right thing or not. Moore doesn't flat out answer those questions, or even say clearly if the idea worked. I don't know if it would.

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

and the 2012 games hosted in london too

[Franka]

I heard that this morning, poor London, just become the 2012 Olympics city and now.........

Actually I hope the 2012 Olympics host in Paris...............

[banishedbayou]

Ever read Watchmen by Alan Moore? There, one of the characters actually "fakes" a deadly alien attack on New York to avert a third world war (though he certainly doesn't fake the deadly part... millions perish). It's an interesting idea... and a big moral dilemma if he did the right thing or not. Moore doesn't flat out answer those questions, or even say clearly if the idea worked. I don't know if it would.

I actually have all the original issues of the Watchmen.

I wonder if Britain is going to behave like Spain after they got bombed. Hopefully the Brits won't back down like the spaniards did.

[tern]

I wonder if Britain is going to behave like Spain after they got bombed. Hopefully the Brits won't back down like the spaniards did.

I don't think so as much. As you see in the forum right now, Britain is used to terrorist attacks (IRA) so this just scratches the surface of their resolve. I think it will be fine.

But yeah, terrible tragedy by absolute monsters. Seems mesopotamia is both the birthplace and death of civilization. (http://www.scrappleface.com/)

[DavidAlizée]

But that group is al-Qaida, not "Muslims" like you keep saying. That's like blaming all Christians for the actions of the Ku Kuk Klan

yes, but... after the bombings, i seen video footage of muslims across the world, and even in London town halls, talking about how these "heros" are doing Gods will. Just like after the twin towers, how the planes "magnificantly" crashed into the towers. These people are not al-Qaida, these are normal muslims who believe that crap in the Koran, to an insane level. By us sitting back and trying to filter out the good muslims from the bad, will never hasppen. While we are doing that, we can expect another attack. It is not just al-Qaida, it is millions of muslims too, who have not got the balls to crash a plane into a building, but still believe in all of this shit, you know. Pisses me off.

When Manchester was bombed, not long ago, the fire department could not get by to help, because the muslims were praying in the street. That was just amazing, if i was driving that fire truck, and if i seen people burning and dying.. i would have drove right over the top of those muslims.

[MetalicGuy]

Maybe some of Londons security cams caught those people behind this...

[PayBays]

Try to get in touch with him but don't be scared if you don't find him the first 2-3 days. Usualy panic makes people forget stuff like the PC.

My friend is safe...i don't know about his family.

And someone posted that maybe Helsinki will be bombed...I'm more scared that Paris will be bombed,since i want to go live there and Alizée comes to work there.

[AlizéeInMYHeart]

And someone posted that maybe Helsinki will be bombed...I'm more scared that Paris will be bombed,since i want to go live there and Alizée comes to work there.

atm I think Helsinki is a more likely target than Paris, if the terrorists plan on making another attack....this cause the World Championships will be held here in a month....would give the terrorists lots of media attaention quickly once again then....but I doubt they will strike....

[Steve]

Quote I heard today from a customer,

"I hate Arabs even more now'

:shock:

[PayBays]

Quote I heard today from a customer,

"I hate Arabs even more now'

:shock:

I did hate them before...man just dropping some bombs on Iraq seems hard

[Bondius]

I'm more scared that Paris will be bombed,since i want to go live there and Alizée comes to work there.
I know you're frightened that something might happen to her but she only goes there to work, you know.
Stay calm, don't worry and hopefuly nothing more will happen.


But by the way it looks, France is next on the list ...

[Snatcher42]

yes, but... after the bombings, i seen video footage of muslims across the world, and even in London town halls, talking about how these "heros" are doing Gods will.
They always pick the insane ones to put on TV, makes better broadcasting. It's still a small radical minority. I've never met a single Muslim (and I've met many, my school is a good 25% or so) that condones these attacks. Besides, start recklessly bombing innocents and non-innocents alike as they do, and we'll just have a worse problem on our hands: the vilest perpetrators will all survive in their underground bunkers only to emerge flipping mad screaming bloody murder. And this time they'll have massive worldwide support behind them. It's not the way to stop this.

I know you're frightened that something might happen to her but she only goes there to work, you know.
Well I would consider Paris her primary residence these days. Still, the odds of her being effected... well, lets just say if you want to worry, there are many things far more likely to happen to her that you could worry about instead. ;)

[PayBays]

I'm more scared that Paris will be bombed,since i want to go live there and Alizée comes to work there.
I know you're frightened that something might happen to her but she only goes there to work, you know.
Stay calm, don't worry and hopefuly nothing more will happen.


But by the way it looks, France is next on the list ...


You totally understand my point.France is one of the 5 Countrys that are in the Europian Unie...I'm affraid that,Paris will be hit by terrorists again.There was,a couple of years ago an serial killer who killed only Moslims...any idea what the Moslims want to do???

I'm really affraid to go there and walk around or living in a house there.It's scared that we aren't save anywhere.Maybe there will be a bomb under your bed in the next 50 years!

[Steve]

Acting like that is just what the terriosts want, people too live in fear. The best thing you can do is just go about your day as much as normal. Also I think people are forgetting Australia, they are a major backer of the war anti-terroism. And being so close to the largest Muslim country in the world, Indonesia it is not long till they hit Australia, esp Sydney

And Paybays if you really feel like that you wont go to Paris,

[PayBays]

^ Is right about that Australian part and the part of beeing scared.Offcourse people are scared,but what can we do about it.Sitting back,staying calm and when another terrorist attacks...it's a mess in Europe...

I will go to France,if i still think the same as today.

[Bondius]

Well the best targets for them are Australia, Italy and France. The other countries are either hit or not really important. I really don't think Osamma Ben-Laden is behind this. He is just a pawn on a much bigger chess table. They just pushed him out of the snake hole and blamed him for all.

[engin turk]

They always pick the insane ones to put on TV, makes better broadcasting. It's still a small radical minority. I've never met a single Muslim (and I've met many, my school is a good 25% or so) that condones these attacks. Besides, start recklessly bombing innocents and non-innocents alike as they do, and we'll just have a worse problem on our hands: the vilest perpetrators will all survive in their underground bunkers only to emerge flipping mad screaming bloody murder. And this time they'll have massive worldwide support behind them. It's not the way to stop this.


I've never met a person that condones these attacks too,and consider that i live in Turkey,which has a 70 million population and 95% of this population is Muslim.You can't see anyone in tens of Turkish TV's like this,including Islamic TV's.I don't know the situation of Muslims in England,i can't make any comment on Britian Muslims.

We don't like Arabs,and they don't like us. :x

[Ayan]

I'm more scared that Paris will be bombedThat won't happen. France didn't support Iraq war. Neither did Germany btw and therefore they should be safer aswell.

[Bondius]

Don't be so sure. I heard that France sent troops to Iraq as well.

[Darius]

I don't think they will attack Paris too. I've read that terrorist threatened on their website that the next will be Italy and Denmark.

[DavidAlizée]

yea, damn right.

Muslims can't do anything if they are kept away from the rest of the world. We gave them a chance, we welcomed them into our country, fed them, gave them jobs ahead of our own people, and this is how the repay us. The fact is tony Blair won't do anything. Nor will Bush...

It is going to take some sort of rouge operation. People were stepping over bodies, people flying across the seats on the bus with no legs. Blood spattered up the side of the buildings. This is not the time to be asking muslims if they agree or dissagree, i couldnt give a flying fuck what they think. The bombers were born in England, it makes it worse. I read some posts here, people are saying stuff like, maybe the olympics should not be held in England. I find that AMAZING, you might as well give a gold medal to the terrorists. A muslim is not going to tell you to your face that he condones these attacks.. when they go home, and start bashing the Koran.

One of them phoned me up today, for a job. I told him to go fuck himself. No muslim gets any kind of respect now. I hope they rot in hell, because when they spend all night praying to the koran, praying to meet other passed on bombers at the gates of heaven.. they will be in for a sorry end, when there is nobody there.

Destroy their religion, hit them where it hurts. Destroy every temple they have. Hit them so bad and so big, they won't have the power to fight back. They can't go into hiding, if a bio weapon is dropped. They will soon get the message.

I'm more scared that Paris will be bombedThat won't happen. France didn't support Iraq war. Neither did Germany btw and therefore they should be safer aswell.

That doesnt matter. They don't want to target countries, they want to take lives. They attacked NY before the war, its got nothing to do with it. Paris is a prime target, they are terrorists. They do not have any planning, they want to kill. It is all in the koran, nothing to do with supporting the war.

btw France does support the wear on terror, and they did send troops into Iraq.

They are damn cowards, how can they even take delight in what they do. It is sneaky and twisted. What do they actually hope to gain by these attacks? To stop us from attacking them? ARE THEY THAT STUPID? that is never going to happen untill they are dead. Do they think they can gain respect of some sort, or maybe scare people. We are not the ones hiding, they are. They are scared, pathetic cowards with a false religion. I hope they rot and burn in hell forever.

[PayBays]

Don't be so sure. I heard that France sent troops to Iraq as well.

Allmost all countrys have send troops,except for Belgium ( it's the only one i know )

[MetalicGuy]

Sweden haven't sent any troops... Because we are cowards..... i read some months ago a statement by Bin Ladin that Sweden is a country that won't be attacked =/.... as i said....

He mentioned something like this "If Bush says that we hate freedom why don't we attack Sweden for example then?"

I think that creates a bad wave.. and some may think that Sweden is a shelter for terrorists... But yeah.. we are too polite to immigrants..

[Snatcher42]

Destroy their religion, hit them where it hurts. Destroy every temple they have. Hit them so bad and so big, they won't have the power to fight back. They can't go into hiding, if a bio weapon is dropped. They will soon get the message.
Have you listened to yourself? You're saying for them exactly what the terrorists say for us, and that's just what groups like al-Qaeda want. To any reasonable Muslim (of which you'd slaughter millions) these terror attacks are a disgusting and sick perversion of the Koran and their religion (which certainly isn't "false"). What you're suggesting is as bad as any genocide attempted in the past by fundamentalists or fascists. No question these bombings are horrific, and no need to say that I know how it feels, but the terrorists want nothing more than to turn this into 'The West vs. The Muslim World.' It's not, though, and as long as we don't make it such, they can never win.

Last, on a more official note for anyone and everyone: Believe what you want about the religion and people, but do try to be a bit more reserved about it on the forum, for the sake of our Muslim members. I know you might be saying, "I don't care what they think", but the forum should be a place where everyone feels welcome.

[engin turk]

yea, damn right.

Muslims can't do anything if they are kept away from the rest of the world. We gave them a chance, we welcomed them into our country, fed them, gave them jobs ahead of our own people, and this is how the repay us. The fact is tony Blair won't do anything. Nor will Bush...

It is going to take some sort of rouge operation. People were stepping over bodies, people flying across the seats on the bus with no legs. Blood spattered up the side of the buildings. This is not the time to be asking muslims if they agree or dissagree, i couldnt give a flying fuck what they think. The bombers were born in England, it makes it worse. I read some posts here, people are saying stuff like, maybe the olympics should not be held in England. I find that AMAZING, you might as well give a gold medal to the terrorists. A muslim is not going to tell you to your face that he condones these attacks.. when they go home, and start bashing the Koran.

One of them phoned me up today, for a job. I told him to go fuck himself. No muslim gets any kind of respect now. I hope they rot in hell, because when they spend all night praying to the koran, praying to meet other passed on bombers at the gates of heaven.. they will be in for a sorry end, when there is nobody there.

Destroy their religion, hit them where it hurts. Destroy every temple they have. Hit them so bad and so big, they won't have the power to fight back. They can't go into hiding, if a bio weapon is dropped. They will soon get the message.

I'm more scared that Paris will be bombedThat won't happen. France didn't support Iraq war. Neither did Germany btw and therefore they should be safer aswell.

That doesnt matter. They don't want to target countries, they want to take lives. They attacked NY before the war, its got nothing to do with it. Paris is a prime target, they are terrorists. They do not have any planning, they want to kill. It is all in the koran, nothing to do with supporting the war.

btw France does support the wear on terror, and they did send troops into Iraq.

They are damn cowards, how can they even take delight in what they do. It is sneaky and twisted. What do they actually hope to gain by these attacks? To stop us from attacking them? ARE THEY THAT STUPID? that is never going to happen untill they are dead. Do they think they can gain respect of some sort, or maybe scare people. We are not the ones hiding, they are. They are scared, pathetic cowards with a false religion. I hope they rot and burn in hell forever.

You go too far!Is this a public Alizee forum or Christian forum,you damn racist!I wait you here,come to Turkey and show me how you will destroy our religion.

[DavidAlizée]

but do try to be a bit more reserved about it on the forum, for the sake of our Muslim members

ha, yeah. Try telling that to the families that have lost their son or daughter in these bombings.

come to Turkey and show me how you will destroy our religion.

how dare you even chat in this topic after what your sort has done to good people! I wouldnt step foot in that dirty country of yours.

[engin turk]

Tell me what was your reason to kill our ancestors in World War I.

[DavidAlizée]

Shut up, this topic is not about that! This is about Good people that died. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU, OR YOUR ANCESTORS, DO NOT bring WW1 up at a time like this, show some respect for the people that lost thier lives! get off the stage! So, stop turning this topic into a fucking muslim discussion about how some are good. This is a topic to discuss the sick and dreadful attacks they have done. Do not try to defend those animals.

[engin turk]

So don't forget I'm a Muslim and be careful when you write your feelings about these bombings.You don't have a right to blame my religion here!

[DavidAlizée]

Do not tell me how i should feel about these bombings, when i may have had friends who died. I can express my anger about these animals. Get out of this topic, you are not welcome here, if you continue to support the animals that caused these bombings.

[PayBays]

I understand the parts that are beeing set up against eachother.Offcourse not all MUSLIMS are terrorists...i did know a MUSLIM that was just like me.I don't think all MUSLIMS have something to do with the bomb-explosions over the world.

[Snatcher42]

Alright, yes you two, enough. Indeed, this is not the place.

ha, yeah. Try telling that to the families that have lost their son or daughter in these bombings.
As I said, I don't need to tell you that I know how it feels... coming from someone who did lose people four years ago. Of course it's outrageous, an unforgivable crime. But don't lose sight of who the enemy is, and who it isn't. That's what makes us different from them.

[engin turk]

Who supports those animals?I wrote many times before,I hate those animals of Al-Qaida.In Nov. 2003,they killed our 27 innocent citizens in Istanbul,you do expect me to support them?

[Ned]

Do not tell me how i should feel about these bombings, when i may have had friends who died. I can express my anger about these animals. Get out of this topic, you are not welcome here, if you continue to support the animals that caused these bombings.
If it's true and you really had friends who died there, let me express my deepest sympathy for them and you off course, David, for these things don't happen so often and it's really a tragedy! And my opinion is that right as we speak, we don't really know what was the cause of this, for it was a shock for me too.

[PayBays]

Do not tell me how i should feel about these bombings, when i may have had friends who died. I can express my anger about these animals. Get out of this topic, you are not welcome here, if you continue to support the animals that caused these bombings.
If it's true and you really had friends who died there, let me express my deepest sympathy for them and you off course, David, for thiese things don't happen so often and it's really a tragedy! And my opinion is that right as we speak, we don't really know what was the cause of this, for it was a shock for me too.

Not only for you.I wish David the best,if he lost some true friends.I also was shocked and scared that one of my best friends could be gone.Luckily i heard something yesterday that he seems to be alive and not hit... :!:

[engin turk]

David,we suffered very much from PKK (Kurdi terrorist group) and we lost our at least 30000 innocent people from 1980 to 2000.We and they are both MUSLIMS.Have ever you heard about that group and the horror in East Anatolia?Think about,a Muslim group can kill 30000 Muslims!You think Turkish people can support terrorism?

[Ned]

But don't lose sight of who the enemy is, and who it isn't. That's what makes us different from them.
The enemy is us with all our mistakes we made by leting all of these scum-bags rule us, based on our ignorance, and lack of respect for others. We must do something, like change ourselves and stand against those who hit us in our face like a slap, but who am I to say that if the others don't feel the same. :|

[Bondius]

You can't rely on some websites for future targets. It can be Paris, Rome, Bucharest or any other major city in a country that supports war on terrorism. London will get past it, as all did from earlier terrorist attacks. We must look to the future.
We can't stop terrorism. There will always be fanatics that will follow their ideeas. We can't blame muslims just because Al-Queda is full of them. I know muslims that are great persons, so don't rush drawnig a conclusion just by the religion.

[Ned]

You can't rely on some websites for future targets. It can be Paris, Rome, Bucharest or any other major city in a country that supports war on terrorism. London will get past it, as all did from earlier terrorist attacks. We must look to the future.
We can't stop terrorism. There will always be fanatics that will follow their ideeas. We can't blame muslims just because Al-Queda is full of them. I know muslims that are great persons, so don't rush drawnig a conclusion just by the religion.
What did I just say, Bogdan? And don't worry, we will not be the target in my opinion, 'cause some 'mighty' world ruler has some interests in this country, that is Romania, don't ask me what it is because this isn't ment to be discussed in public. Anyways there are interests all over the world but the muslims are just pawns in this game for world domination used by the americans by taking all the fossil fuel to themselves, and leading nowhere but to distruction and oblivion (as if it was not enough that the man kind is inclined to evil, that is especially distruction).
As when it comes for the muslims Djihad, this isn't the 'Saint War', not by a long shot, it is just an obsession or, I underline, or another wicked, deceiving game on the 'chess table', anyone who knows the Koran must know this is true what I say.

[PayBays]

You all have to know,that some countries in Europe have a defence that...how can i say it nicely...it SUCKS BIG TIME!If we just let the terrorist on the left...and pick up your own country problems.Here in Holland,there have been shot 2 very important people in the last 5 years.There was also a kid that shot his teacher at school.I know this has nothing to do with yesterday,but you all know that our defence isn't high enough for those terrorists.

Now the bomb dropped they are going to "defence" the countrys some more.It's to late for that,after Madrid,London and New York you can't say who's going to strike where.Our country's are a mess if it comes to defences.If a kid can shoot someone to death at school,the terrorists can come into our land more easily.

You all have to agree with me,our defences suck!

[Emmerdale001]

Ultimately, I condemn every violent act against every human. These attacks are the same way with me. To destroy life, to ruin the lives of people, to inflict misery--this is not the way to live with your fellow neighbors. I was told once, "Do not aggress. God does not love the aggressor." I believe it. God sides with the victims and the peacemakers, not the warmongers and the terrorists.

Violence should and must always come as a last resort. However, in too many cases in recent years violence was not the last resort; it was the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd option, not the last one.

The group that claims they did this attack did it because of the UK's involvement in the Iraq War. I lay the blame primarily at the feet of the perpetrators of these attacks; what they did is truly barbaric and should be condemned without question, and they must be arrested and tried for murder, but I also lay some amount of blame at the feet of Tony Blair himself just as I laid a fair amount of blame at the feet of the former prime minister of Spain Jose Maria Aznar, before the people sacked him after the Madrid 3/11 attacks. Aznar took his nation to war even though the people overwhelmingly were against war. As a result, he made his own people targets in the eyes of Al Qaeda, and innocent people paid the awful price of both Aznar's and Al Qaeda's actions.

I condemn terrorism in every form. However, I came to realize a fairly long time ago that terrorism cannot be addressed without first understanding the situation that led to terrorism taking root in the first place. The argument that "they hate us for our freedoms" is one I never believed. People just don't wake up one day and decide they want to drive their plane into the side of a building.

I would point to foreign policy over the last several decades as the problem. They hate us not because of "our freedoms" but what we have done repeatedly in the Middle East over the last 50 years. When nations such as the US and others support arab dictatorships over the heads of these people in places like Saudi Arabia with the House of Saud or that tyrant Mubarak in Egypt or the damn Shah in Iran who slaughtered his own people or even Saddam Hussein in the 1980s, you're going to generate a pool full of radicalism, hatred, resentment, and ultimately despair.

That's the perfect breeding ground for terrorism, like swamp water to mosquitos. All that is then required is for someone like Osama to come along and convince the angry, oppressed people that the only solution is to use violence, and then the cycle of violence is complete.

Does this make me anti-American as some have accused me? I don't believe it does. If I were truly anti-American, I would never speak up when the government that is supposed to represent me commits a wrong against me or other people. I'm anti-Iraq War; that's for sure. The justification for that war simply did not exist, no weapons of mass destruction, but no, I don't consider myself anti-American. Loving someone means that you recognize that person for both their strengths...as well as their weaknesses. It's the same way with the government.

[Ned]

You all have to know,that some countries in Europe have a defence that...how can i say it nicely...it SUCKS BIG TIME!If we just let the terrorist on the left...and pick up your own country problems.Here in Holland,there have been shot 2 very important people in the last 5 years.There was also a kid that shot his teacher at school.I know this has nothing to do with yesterday,but you all know that our defence isn't high enough for those terrorists.

Now the bomb dropped they are going to "defence" the countrys some more.It's to late for that,after Madrid,London and New York you can't say who's going to strike where.Our country's are a mess if it comes to defences.If a kid can shoot someone to death at school,the terrorists can come into our land more easily.

You all have to agree with me,our defences suck!
Yeah, why not. Because it's made by people with the same 'morale' like the atackers, so it's easy to atack this way!

[DavidAlizée]

I don't lay any blame at Tony Blair, Bush or any other leader that helped America in this war. The war on terror was important. England will always back America tho, as will America with us. Also, many other countries cannot be held responsable. The attacks on America, Spain and England are the worst attacks i have ever seen. Ofc, the twin towers was more worse than any of the attacks so far. The thing that scares me, is.. i have said before that i was waching the tv, keeping up-to date with the attacks, and i saw some guy, giving a speech in the town hall, about how they should honour them. They were actually in Britian that moment. That, is a huge security risk. The people who were at the speech, are still living here, that feel the people that did this, are heros.

ofc, it is impossible to know when and where an attack might happen. The best we can hope for is not to many casualites and the bombers die an horric death. The, we start picking up the pieces of our contries. This is not an ideal world, clearly this is down to religion. I am sure God is looking down on them in disgust.

While many of us are praying for the families, muslims are praying to the koran, and planning thier next attack. You don't see catholics, protastants, christians doing this, the bible is clear to love one another. Their end is near, we will have our bible and faith. They will have their "book of the dead" and faith led by a false prophet.

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

Blair: terrorists will not win

NYC on full alert, Security Tightened

World Unites to track killers



http://www.nynewsday.com/other/special/amny/



cast your vote

[DavidAlizée]

upping the security means nothing imo. It doesnt matter if you had 500,000 Police and the armed forces. There is nothing to stop this attack from happening. car bombs, such a cowards way out. All it takes is a muslim, with a bomb on his back to sit on a bus. No security will prevent this. Something needs to be done, and fast.

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

what nuke everybody :?: :?: :roll: :roll:

[Emmerdale001]

Wait a second, not all Muslims are terrorists. If anyone has been ignored in this stupid conflict, it has been moderate Muslims. The extremists always make the news, but you never hear anything from ordinary Muslims living on the streets in places like Cairo or Riyadh or even Paris or Berlin. I had college classes with a Muslim from Pakistan. He was a great guy. He was as far from supporting terrorism as anyone else I've met.

There are a fair amount of terrorists where I live, and they aren't Muslims. They call themselves Christians, but they hate Jews, Blacks, and others and have resorted to burning down churches because they are Black churches in the last several years here. I, as well as some of my friends, was victimized by arson where I live because I had the audacity to stand up for my principles against hate and intolerance.

The problem isn't Muslims or religion. The problem is intolerance and hate.

People should be allowed to hold whatever beliefs they want. That's their right. I have no issue with radical beliefs. What they believe may strike me as odd, and they can believe whatever they want, but the point where I have a problem with them is when they become intolerant of differing views and opinions. That's when it becomes a problem.

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

i have no problem with radical beliefs but i say nuke not all of them

[PayBays]

It's been a fight between the one who thinks that all Muslims are terrorists and the other one,who's a Muslim him/herself that thinks not

You can't see in peoples minds if they stick to the Koran or not.Some people are still under pressure by some kinda power ( like Saddam,although he isn't the leader anymore ) There are some people who are alive and have a great power,they keep on pressing on the people to do suicide acts because they still believe,what Saddam said is the best.

You can't take Saddam out of the people,but you can take the people away from Saddam

It's sad that some people are still beeing under pressure by some kinda higher power then them.So they have to do what they say,otherwise they still die.Some people want to do something for their country and think that,what they are doing,is good. :roll:

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

is the US fault of teaching this guy i forgot him name

[DavidAlizée]

Wait a second, not all Muslims are terrorists. If anyone has been ignored in this stupid conflict, it has been moderate Muslims. The extremists always make the news, but you never hear anything from ordinary Muslims living on the streets in places like Cairo or Riyadh or even Paris or Berlin. I had college classes with a Muslim from Pakistan. He was a great guy. He was as far from supporting terrorism as anyone else I've met.

There are a fair amount of terrorists where I live, and they aren't Muslims. They call themselves Christians, but they hate Jews, Blacks, and others and have resorted to burning down churches because they are Black churches in the last several years here. I, as well as some of my friends, was victimized by arson where I live because I had the audacity to stand up for my principles against hate and intolerance.

The problem isn't Muslims or religion. The problem is intolerance and hate.

People should be allowed to hold whatever beliefs they want. That's their right. I have no issue with radical beliefs. What they believe may strike me as odd, and they can believe whatever they want, but the point where I have a problem with them is when they become intolerant of differing views and opinions. That's when it becomes a problem.

DUDE, wtf.

The problem is religion. Why did those people crash the planes into the towers? Because they believe they were doing Gods will. Why did the people attack us, because we interfeared with their affairs, regarding religion. It is a religious group that believe in the koran, and taking things to the next level. It is not about hate, although it has a huge part to play. It is about Religion. PERIOD.


There are a fair amount of terrorists where I live, and they aren't Muslims. They call themselves Christians, but they hate Jews, Blacks, and others and have resorted to burning down churches because they are Black churches in the last several years here

Don't be so bloody STUPID!

Not only do i beleive you are talking complete BS.. but you also have no idea what a Christian is. No Christian would burn down a church because they black users go there. I don't BELIEVE YOU!

I can't answer for the hating of Jews, but i can tell you Catholics do not hate Jews. JP even tried to make peace with the jews. Don't even try to worm Christians to being Terrorists.. Idiot. Do not even go there.

This is about Muslims, and the attacks they have done. Christians do some bad things yes, but they are NOT terrorists.
There are muslims near me too, i was out driving before and i saw two of them walking down the street, laughing and joking on as if the news was didnt exisit. No respect at all. Even if some muslims don't agree with what has happened. It does not take away the pain and suffering. Right now, Britian doesn care if muslims are sorry for what has happened, we don't care what they think! please... i feel the same way. With all due respect! the last thing we need is muslim support. It adds gas to a raging fire.

MAN! Hours after the bombings, the Police and emergency services were fighting to save lives. The muslims were holding Flags "don't attack us" i mean wtf.. It isnt about you! not today!.. so take your flags and banners and go back home. Think of the ones that is dying for a change, not yourselfs! No one cares.

[lumines67]

You have very perverted and naive, but hateful views David. No christian terrorists? What do you think the KKK was? I have very good friends that are muslims, and they are even more disgusted by these terrorists because they're dragging their peaceful religion into the ground.

[DavidAlizée]

You have very perverted and naive, but hateful views David

Yes my views are of hate, for obvious freakin reasons.

The KKK were nothing compared to those. I don't care about the KKK, they have no part in the Roman Catholic church, so to be honest i don't care. The KKK are evil, yes.. They are not Christians. They might claim to be, but they don't even follow the bible. The difference is, the el qaeda read the Koran to an insane level they are actually going against everything it stands for. The KKK don't even follow the bible, they should not even be classed as religious. They just hate blacks.

I have very good friends that are muslims, and they are even more disgusted by these terrorists because they're dragging their peaceful religion into the ground

You hit the nail right on the head. They are even more disgusted.. not because so many have died, but because they are dragging their religion through the ground.

Yet again, this is NOT about Christians!! Styop trying to turn this topic into a Christian vs muslims. The only Christians i see, are the ones who are burieng their dead, pal!

[Moco]

While I realize the need to release one's anger over the horrific events that took place, please keep in mind that we can't throw out all the rules just because something like this has happened. You are free to express your opinions on the matter, but there are limitations. Let me cite the forum rules:

Do not post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, hateful, threatening, racist, sexually-orientated or any other material that may offend either Alizée, the forum, or its users.
Every member has the right to be able to express his or her opinion, whether it is positive or negative, as long as it is posted in a respectful manner, without any intent to provoke, insult, or flame other members. Speak to others as you would wish they speak to you. If you disagree with another person’s opinion, explain, in a civil manner, why you disagree and don’t just resort to name-calling just because you think that person is wrong.
Everyone please keep these rules in mind because I would hate to have to close this topic. This is a subject that deserves to be discussed, but hate, intolerance and disrespect towards others will not be allowed.

[engin turk]

You have very perverted and naive, but hateful views David

Yes my views are of hate, for obvious freakin reasons.

The KKK were nothing compared to those. I don't care about the KKK, they have no part in the Roman Catholic church, so to be honest i don't care. The KKK are evil, yes.. They are not Christians. They might claim to be, but they don't even follow the bible. The difference is, the el qaeda read the Koran to an insane level they are actually going against everything it stands for. The KKK don't even follow the bible, they should not even be classed as religious. They just hate blacks.

I have very good friends that are muslims, and they are even more disgusted by these terrorists because they're dragging their peaceful religion into the ground

You hit the nail right on the head. They are even more disgusted.. not because so many have died, but because they are dragging their religion through the ground.

Yet again, this is NOT about Christians!! Stop trying to turn this topic into a Christian vs muslims. The only Christians i see, are the ones who are burieng their dead, pal!

He is right.Be sure David,Turkish people and of course I am more disgusted than you because of this reason.Those cannot be real Muslims.It is sure that the main point is religion,I agree,but they are dragging our religion into the ground.

If you want us to stop turning this topic a Christian vs Muslim topic,please don't use the words "Muslim and Koran" to mean terrorists and terrorism.I don't know Christianity well and I don't make any comment.You don't know real Islam,stop denigrating Islam till you learn real Islam.Turkey is the best place to see real Islam.:wink:

While I realize the need to release one's anger over the horrific events that took place, please keep in mind that we can't throw out all the rules just because something like this has happened. You are free to express your opinions on the matter, but there are limitations. Let me cite the forum rules:

Do not post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, hateful, threatening, racist, sexually-orientated or any other material that may offend either Alizée, the forum, or its users.
Every member has the right to be able to express his or her opinion, whether it is positive or negative, as long as it is posted in a respectful manner, without any intent to provoke, insult, or flame other members. Speak to others as you would wish they speak to you. If you disagree with another person’s opinion, explain, in a civil manner, why you disagree and don’t just resort to name-calling just because you think that person is wrong.
Everyone please keep these rules in mind because I would hate to have to close this topic. This is a subject that deserves to be discussed, but hate, intolerance and disrespect towards others will not be allowed.

I agree with you.

[PayBays]

I could have been into the fight...i don't care about Christians and Muslims,cause i don't see the connection between a Religion War and a Terrorisme Attack

[Ned]

For any particular reason, why can't you all see that this is all the work of satanic societies. By being blind, makes you feel full of hate to and narrow sighted, and this doesn't help the others at all, so try to look for the truth in another place, because I'm sure you didn't find it in this manner. And please, stop insulting and hating yourselves!

[Emmerdale001]

The problem is religion. Why did those people crash the planes into the towers? Because they believe they were doing Gods will.

They were made to believe that by people like Osama who are using the situation to their advantage. They take the Koran and they quote verses out of context to justify the killing of innocent civilians.

Why did the people attack us, because we interfeared with their affairs, regarding religion.

Osama himself listed three reasons for why he declared his holy war against the US. 1) We were building bases on land in Saudi Arabia he considered holy. 2) We support oppressive arab governments that kill and persecute its own people such as Saudi Arabia and Egypt, and 3) our support of Israel's policy with the construction of illegal settlements in the West Bank/Gaza Strip.

It is a religious group that believe in the koran, and taking things to the next level. It is not about hate, although it has a huge part to play. It is about Religion. PERIOD.

I'm sorry, but I disagree. I think in this case religion is being used as a tool by people like Osama.

Don't be so bloody STUPID!

Not only do i beleive you are talking complete BS.. but you also have no idea what a Christian is. No Christian would burn down a church because they black users go there. I don't BELIEVE YOU!

OK, stop right there. If you are going to resort to calling me stupid, we're not going to get anywhere fast. Furthermore, you'd be breaking the rules.

I do know what a Christian is. You underestimate what I know, but there are nutjobs in the past around here where I live who tried to use the Bible to justify slavery by saying that Blacks deserve it because they are the descendants of the cursed Ham. That is a fact. Do I consider them Christians? No. A real Christian follows peace, love, compassion, forgiveness, and justice, but that didn't stop these fools from using the Bible to justify their heinous crimes.

The reason why I brought up idiots like the KKK and militant folks in the US like the Army of God is to demonstrate a point.

You keep saying that it's the Muslims who did it, but not every Muslim is a terrorist. The same way with Christians. Just because a person claims to be a Christian does not mean he is automatically someone who supports targeting Blacks or Jews or blowing up clinics or setting fire to minority churches. That's simply not true in both cases.

[Ned]

The problem is religion. Why did those people crash the planes into the towers? Because they believe they were doing Gods will.

They were made to believe that by people like Osama who are using the situation to their advantage. They take the Koran and they quote verses out of context to justify the killing of innocent civilians.

Why did the people attack us, because we interfeared with their affairs, regarding religion.

Osama himself listed three reasons for why he declared his holy war against the US. 1) We were building bases on land in Saudi Arabia he considered holy. 2) We support oppressive arab governments that kill and persecute its own people such as Saudi Arabia and Egypt, and 3) our support of Israel's policy with the construction of illegal settlements in the West Bank/Gaza Strip.

It is a religious group that believe in the koran, and taking things to the next level. It is not about hate, although it has a huge part to play. It is about Religion. PERIOD.

I'm sorry, but I disagree. I think in this case religion is being used as a tool by people like Osama.

Don't be so bloody STUPID!

Not only do i beleive you are talking complete BS.. but you also have no idea what a Christian is. No Christian would burn down a church because they black users go there. I don't BELIEVE YOU!

OK, stop right there. If you are going to resort to calling me stupid, we're not going to get anywhere fast. Furthermore, you'd be breaking the rules.

I do know what a Christian is. You underestimate what I know, but there are nutjobs in the past around here where I live who tried to use the Bible to justify slavery by saying that Blacks deserve it because they are the descendants of the cursed Ham. That is a fact. Do I consider them Christians? No. A real Christian follows peace, love, compassion, forgiveness, and justice, but that didn't stop these fools from using the Bible to justify their heinous crimes.

The reason why I brought up idiots like the KKK and militant folks in the US like the Army of God is to demonstrate a point.

You keep saying that it's the Muslims who did it, but not every Muslim is a terrorist. The same way with Christians. Just because a person claims to be a Christian does not mean he is automatically someone who supports targeting Blacks or Jews or blowing up clinics or setting fire to minority churches. That's simply not true in both cases.
Well done, I'd say, Emmerdale, I clap my hands on this one! Anyways, there are some reasons ofc, for doing this, especially blaming the religion to be the drug of the people, and not only that but they used the religion in order to establish new so called laws, and plans they had for this planet. We are all driven by hatery all the way, because they want us to do so, and they implanted the notion 'God' everywhere to make us believe in what they want us to believe. Why do you think Bush was a raging alcoholic and a stupid kid in highschool, and still, he is the president of the U.S.? If you would believe that KKK still exists in the U.S. and rules too, you would have a slight idea of what they are capable to do to us, so the discussion continues on and on about all those who accepted Satan to be their number one 'God'. And they are telling us that they believe in God? How come? That's a bunch of nonsense! They twisted the Koran even! So they put the blame entirely on the muslims, and we all know that this is wrong, period.
You are right when you say we have the right to an opinion, but if we do just like other users here, we are heading nowhere, but to hatery again and again, and to bad thoughts (prejudged even) about every religious clan on our planet! It doesn't work like that! We must look somewhere else for the truth, onestly! Like learn anything about these people, about exactly what they are capable to do here and there! Than we must act, as one even, just like that: in the name of love, peace and harmony, not just to us, but to the others around us too!

[Orion]

I am a Roman Catholic and I have 8 Muslim friends (all from Turkey) and they are the nicest people you'd ever want to meet. We do not mix religions, only friendship. The problem with this world is that it is too disorganized; too overlooked. How are extremists transformed to do certain things and think in certain ways? It begins with an idea, fear, hate losing one's self to blind thoughts and then leads to action. Finding yourself with the wrong "friends" who preach hate in God's name, you will soon find yourself fighting a jihad. These people represent the 3rd anti-Christ - not an individual this time, but a group wanting to overthrow the West. They are a curse unto themselves as much as they are a curse unto us - they are not what Allah intended when thier soul entered their body.

How do we cure this: muslims need to start at home while raising their young. Those who preach hate in God's name in Mosques should be dealt with via a body of muslims for true Islam made up of a group of priests (don't know the right term) that have secret attendants in every mosque to watch out for hate and extremism. Middle Eastern governments should start using some of that oil money on its own people; when the minimum wage is 100 dollars a month and you have 5 children to clothe and feed, it is very easy to lose touch with reality and to lose hope (it is their children who are becomming extremists just like it is the young Palestinians who are given an AK-47 at age 6 and taught to kill the great satans Israel and the U.S). Furthermore, there should be erected immediately a central intelligence body in Central Europe, and possibly one in the middle east somewhere, whose sole purpose will be to gather intelligence, incorporate it into a plan and the, with the cooperation of all States, strike down the cells. In the back ground of all this, there should be East West Peace and friendship media played throughout the ME so as to assist children of the evils and wrongs of extremism. etc ,etc, etc . . . . . .

Write your representatives, your congressmen . . . your government and let them know the the new world order will be governed by our will and not the will of government any longer. We have the voice and the vote . . . . . next election, let them know what you want concerning this topic and tell them that from now on, they will be elected to do the mending of this world. Let the U.S pull out of the Middle East. Let the Palestinians have their land. Clean the Mosques and lets gather the hate mongers. Tell the middle eastern countires to adopt democracy; to build an infrastructure for a viable economy. Educate and raise pay. finally (??) I want to see Muslims and Christians hold a world anti-terrorism day and make it better and bigger than Live 8. All middle Eastern countries should have their streets filled with peace makers with a universal message to the terrorists . . . it will demoralize extremists and possibly awaken some from their nightmare.

But before it gets better, it will get a whole lot worse. Expect more evil to come on a global scale; then the dust will settle, the blood will dry up, the buildings will be erected again. Rome, Paris, Istanbul, New York, Toronto, London, Geneva, Tokyo, and Berlin exchanges should keep guard for a co ordinated attack to disrupt the world economy. Today, terrorism is a science ans they have executive positions in a military atmosphere . . . . . . . very deadly. These people are not just lost children and poor folk, they are doctors, lawyers scientists (I won`t talk about chemical warfare here (children present) and rich businessmen. So, hold on for a rough ride because it will be as difficult to rid this world of terrorism as it will be to rid ants from your home . . .

ALIZÈE, PLEASE COME BACK ASAP * I NEED A `VACATION` FROM MYSELF

[Steve]

Orion you obviously dont have a grasp on reality

Let the U.S pull out of the Middle East. Let the Palestinians have their land. Clean the Mosques and lets gather the hate mongers.
Let the US pull out of the middle East?? wtf the U.S are there on their own accord no one stopping them leave, they already have that option but they wont leave as would anyone with a job half complete. You cant just give the Palestinians what they want because that is giving in to the terrorists, So what happens Israel then?? Should we just forget about it?? Its the Birth place of Christ and Orion as you are a RC i would have thought this of all places should be kept as the Holy Land.

Tell the middle eastern countires to adopt democracy; to build an infrastructure for a viable economy Thats nice, lets just tell them Im sure they will comply

All middle Eastern countries should have their streets filled with peace makers with a universal message to the terrorists . . . it will demoralize extremists and possibly awaken some from their nightmare.

How will it demoralize extremists?? It will only create more targets, the only way too demoralize extremists is to get rid of everyone single one, every single person who sympathises them and every government who harbours these extremists.

- they are not what Allah intended when thier soul entered their body. and im not quite sure what you ment here.

[Mordecai]

A-Bomb... .

[DavidAlizée]

regarding the holy land, i must point out something. When the war went from palistine, into Bethlehem, historical churches were threatened. I remember, about 200 palistines were trapped inside a small part of bethlehem. Not by our troops, but by the local who lived in Bethlehem, they were not armed with guns, but swords. If the war starts to get neat Jeruselum, things will get nasty. I pray it does not get that far, that is sacrad ground.

I have not read all of your post Orion, because i explained so in my PM, things are looking better now, ive never been as worried in all my life, thats for sure. Anyway, i guess i am still angry at muslims in general, not just because of the bombings, but lack of respect. ( the ones living in the uk )

When we look at the bible, do we search for answers to this dreadful war, or do we start to read the revelations. I hope, the time has not come for that, but the bible will help us through this dreadful time. It is the book of all answers, as well as the catholic church. I may be speaking at a mass for those who died in these attacks, a special mass to pray for the dead and families.

My point is, countries should unite at a time like this. Even tho England was attacked, lets hope the next target is not rome. If the vatican gets attacked, expect a war they can't win. If the muslims attack the Vatican, they might as well decalare war on all Catholics and Christians across the globe, as well as so many countries.

So my point is, and i find it hard to say this. We are going to sit back, wait for the next attack. We can't do anything about it, we can't prevent it, i await another thread to be opened very soon about another attack. No-one can tell the difference between a muslim and el-quiada. So, to try and filter them out, is impossible, therfore.. this war cannot be won.

[Orion]

Orion you obviously dont have a grasp on reality

Let the U.S pull out of the Middle East. Let the Palestinians have their land. Clean the Mosques and lets gather the hate mongers.
Let the US pull out of the middle East?? wtf the U.S are there on their own accord no one stopping them leave, they already have that option but they wont leave as would anyone with a job half complete. You cant just give the Palestinians what they want because that is giving in to the terrorists, So what happens Israel then?? Should we just forget about it?? Its the Birth place of Christ and Orion as you are a RC i would have thought this of all places should be kept as the Holy Land.

Tell the middle eastern countires to adopt democracy; to build an infrastructure for a viable economy Thats nice, lets just tell them Im sure they will comply

All middle Eastern countries should have their streets filled with peace makers with a universal message to the terrorists . . . it will demoralize extremists and possibly awaken some from their nightmare.

How will it demoralize extremists?? It will only create more targets, the only way too demoralize extremists is to get rid of everyone single one, every single person who sympathises them and every government who harbours these extremists.

- they are not what Allah intended when thier soul entered their body. and im not quite sure what you ment here.

I understand your objections, but, with respect, don't question my reality before you have understood what I have said.

YES, let the U.S. leave the ME and leave the "job" to the Middle eastewrn countries. Iraq is one big mess that will not go away. Terrorists will never stop their operations there as long as the U.S is there to fuel their fire. The Muslim world is not made up of a bunch of terrorists; that's why it will noit be hard to form a cooperation amoungst them to root out terrorism. The subject of culture alone is why the remainder of the job in the ME should be left up to them. But this does not happen overnight, ofcourse. And no, giving the Palestinians what they want is not giving in toi the terrorists, it's giving in to the Palestinians what would, in the end be a fair and agreed upon plan for a 2 state system. The terrorsits want all of Israel to go to new Palestine. That's reality for you steve; and that's also the way to keep the Holy land Holy: compromise. And about democracy in the Mid E, Saudi Arabia has already begun to crack down on false preachers spreading hatred in the mosques and they have begun the push for full democracy: women can vote and hold office now . . . it's a once step at a time type deal, and it has to be done in steps. That cooperation will be formed.

Ofcourse you get rid of everyone who sympathizes with terrorists or harbours them; that's one piece of the puzzle. Reality again Steve: there has to be a foundation for all this to happen, to stop the extremist spread and growth, not just to punish the sympathizers. We are back to the step by step process again. Why do the terrorists see the U.S as the great Satan? Why should the U.S. keep their bases in the Mid E (the U.S wants to pull out soon and establish a government there ASAP). History will show you reality, and hidden agendas.

Like Blair said, these attacks have only strengthened our resolve further.

Anyway Steve, you sound a bit angry with me??? I hope you are not because I am not upset with anything you have said. In fact, aside from your rhetorical questions, what you have said is not really that off the mark. Sure it will be hard to do what I suggested, but it is harder now to listen to the old clichés about how to combat terrorism. Sure, let's keep them, but we need a new foundation for observing the reality of the situation. I used to get very upset and VERY mad at all muslims, but that blinded me to the fact of what we have to accomplish together.

anyway, don't worry: the terrorists will see their ends and so will we see ours; but until then, a lot of shit will hit the fan and a lot of people will die.

(what I meant- your last remark- Bin Laden was not born a terrorist, he evolved that way. As a Roman Catholic, I say he is not what God intended.)

Remember, that you cannot defeat the terroists by terrorizing them; you defeat them going to the sources, as I explained in my first post. But by all means, if you see a terrorist, KILL the SOB. Remember when they caught that palestinian terrorist in Jerusalem?? He was just a kid. I wish I could find what he said because it will tell you a lot about the blindness he acknowledged about his views. We need to go to the sources . . . and do wwhat I stated. I know that the world will change for the better if we all understand every point of view. Take care all!

[Ramon_Morales_Jr]

it sucks big time :roll: :roll: :roll:

[tern]

I still can't believe the father of modern terrorism, Yassir Arafat, got the nobel peace prize. That is disgusting.

[Ned]

I am a Roman Catholic and I have 8 Muslim friends (all from Turkey) and they are the nicest people you'd ever want to meet. We do not mix religions, only friendship. The problem with this world is that it is too disorganized; too overlooked. How are extremists transformed to do certain things and think in certain ways? It begins with an idea, fear, hate losing one's self to blind thoughts and then leads to action. Finding yourself with the wrong "friends" who preach hate in God's name, you will soon find yourself fighting a jihad. These people represent the 3rd anti-Christ - not an individual this time, but a group wanting to overthrow the West. They are a curse unto themselves as much as they are a curse unto us - they are not what Allah intended when thier soul entered their body.

How do we cure this: muslims need to start at home while raising their young. Those who preach hate in God's name in Mosques should be dealt with via a body of muslims for true Islam made up of a group of priests (don't know the right term) that have secret attendants in every mosque to watch out for hate and extremism. Middle Eastern governments should start using some of that oil money on its own people; when the minimum wage is 100 dollars a month and you have 5 children to clothe and feed, it is very easy to lose touch with reality and to lose hope (it is their children who are becomming extremists just like it is the young Palestinians who are given an AK-47 at age 6 and taught to kill the great satans Israel and the U.S). Furthermore, there should be erected immediately a central intelligence body in Central Europe, and possibly one in the middle east somewhere, whose sole purpose will be to gather intelligence, incorporate it into a plan and the, with the cooperation of all States, strike down the cells. In the back ground of all this, there should be East West Peace and friendship media played throughout the ME so as to assist children of the evils and wrongs of extremism. etc ,etc, etc . . . . . .

Write your representatives, your congressmen . . . your government and let them know the the new world order will be governed by our will and not the will of government any longer. We have the voice and the vote . . . . . next election, let them know what you want concerning this topic and tell them that from now on, they will be elected to do the mending of this world. Let the U.S pull out of the Middle East. Let the Palestinians have their land. Clean the Mosques and lets gather the hate mongers. Tell the middle eastern countires to adopt democracy; to build an infrastructure for a viable economy. Educate and raise pay. finally (??) I want to see Muslims and Christians hold a world anti-terrorism day and make it better and bigger than Live 8. All middle Eastern countries should have their streets filled with peace makers with a universal message to the terrorists . . . it will demoralize extremists and possibly awaken some from their nightmare.

But before it gets better, it will get a whole lot worse. Expect more evil to come on a global scale; then the dust will settle, the blood will dry up, the buildings will be erected again. Rome, Paris, Istanbul, New York, Toronto, London, Geneva, Tokyo, and Berlin exchanges should keep guard for a co ordinated attack to disrupt the world economy. Today, terrorism is a science ans they have executive positions in a military atmosphere . . . . . . . very deadly. These people are not just lost children and poor folk, they are doctors, lawyers scientists (I won`t talk about chemical warfare here (children present) and rich businessmen. So, hold on for a rough ride because it will be as difficult to rid this world of terrorism as it will be to rid ants from your home . . .

ALIZÈE, PLEASE COME BACK ASAP * I NEED A `VACATION` FROM MYSELF
It is a nice thought, but do you think that by coming together as one like we are today arguing for no reason whatsoever, we will withstand these dominants? Not a chance! Although they need us, they could might as well somehow distroy us just like they did in Khirkistan. It's not the terrorisim, but the secret organizations such as C.I.A. or F.B.I. who rules every extremist parties.


How will it demoralize extremists?? It will only create more targets, the only way too demoralize extremists is to get rid of everyone single one, every single person who sympathises them and every government who harbours these extremists.
That is the cause - effect law! Don't get rid of the effect because it will come back, because the cause still exists. Do it with the cause, which is exactly the people with their own flaws, so it will be a lot easier to change one's mind as in mentality then to get rid of all the extremists, for it will be another party coming soon, and this on and on, endless.

regarding the holy land, i must point out something. When the war went from palistine, into Bethlehem, historical churches were threatened. I remember, about 200 palistines were trapped inside a small part of bethlehem. Not by our troops, but by the local who lived in Bethlehem, they were not armed with guns, but swords. If the war starts to get neat Jeruselum, things will get nasty. I pray it does not get that far, that is sacrad ground.

I have not read all of your post Orion, because i explained so in my PM, things are looking better now, ive never been as worried in all my life, thats for sure. Anyway, i guess i am still angry at muslims in general, not just because of the bombings, but lack of respect. ( the ones living in the uk )

When we look at the bible, do we search for answers to this dreadful war, or do we start to read the revelations. I hope, the time has not come for that, but the bible will help us through this dreadful time. It is the book of all answers, as well as the catholic church. I may be speaking at a mass for those who died in these attacks, a special mass to pray for the dead and families.

My point is, countries should unite at a time like this. Even tho England was attacked, lets hope the next target is not rome. If the vatican gets attacked, expect a war they can't win. If the muslims attack the Vatican, they might as well decalare war on all Catholics and Christians across the globe, as well as so many countries.

So my point is, and i find it hard to say this. We are going to sit back, wait for the next attack. We can't do anything about it, we can't prevent it, i await another thread to be opened very soon about another attack. No-one can tell the difference between a muslim and el-quiada. So, to try and filter them out, is impossible, therfore.. this war cannot be won.
This war is going on there for only one reason, that is: Jesus Christ was a jew. You can call me crazy, but if you would find out what I did years ago, you wouldn't call me crazy at all. To think of it the history as we knew it is just a lie they told us to make us believe what they wanted us to believe. There is another history, the real one, with the truth that was hidden all along for us, and with the real facts.

[DavidAlizée]

ofc Jesus Christ was a Jew, thats why the romans put the sign above his cross. King of the Jews. I don't see your point tho, i mean, are you trying to say in so many words that you believe one of these crazy internet conspiracy stories about Jesus Christ? I'm confused.

[Ned]

ofc Jesus Christ was a Jew, thats why the romans put the sign above his cross. King of the Jews. I don't see your point tho, i mean, are you trying to say in so many words that you believe one of these crazy internet conspiracy stories about Jesus Christ? I'm confused.
Ok, I'll tell you what I ment. It's all about a story told in the Bible, if and only if you believe the Bible, and I doubt you don't. It was about not only the story but the interpretation of it by so many occultists. They said Jesus was the King of the Jews, decendent from David. It all started in the Old Testament.
I read a book once, it was called 'The Twelveth Planet', written by Zeccharia Sitchin, a russian occultist. He said that Adam and Eve (our ancestors) were created by a group of aliens called the Annunaki. They enslaved the descendents next to come from Adam and Eve, in a city (if I'm not mistaking) called Eden established by them in Mesopotamia(regarding to this, the legend of Adam and Eve wasn't a 'fairy tale' at all).
The Annunaki were ruled by Anu the father of Enki and Enlil (regarding to this, please read 'The Ghilgamesh Epopee' were the character called Enkidu appears). Enki was the good one, Enlil the opposite. Enlil started a conspiracy against his father, which ended with the elimination of Anu, and the announcing for the title the 'King' for Enlil by the Great Council. Later Enlil eliminated Enki, his brother (which had an eternal fight against). Enki formed a secret society called 'The Brotherhood of the Serpent' (ancestors of the real freemasonry and the Illuminati). The serpent, in the occult sciences means intelligence or wisdom.
Next was the appearence of Jahwe (Jehova) in the Israel, whom was Enlil, according to the expert occultists, which still was in war with his brother (look for the so called war between God - Jahwe, and angel Sataniel - Satan as we know - very confusing, but please read Zeccharia's book for detailes). So we are at the point were Jesus was born ('the Son of God' - the Old Testament's Jahwe). He was, according to so many occultists, an avatar, a preacher or a prophet, by me all of them. As an avatar he was called, ofc according to them, Jesua ben Joseph (Jesua son of Joseph - in hebrew). Therefore he was a jew and Son of God, the war still continues, Israel is somewhat cursed with being in war forever I might say. So The Brotherhood of the Serpent, now Illuminati as we know them (the shadow rulers of the world who wants to establish 'The New World Order') still fights a war against the 'root' of Jesus, as in The Middle East, in particular Israel, and the muslims too. So as you see it's more then just a stupid conspiracy from anywhere on the internet full of information, it's rather having an occult meaning so I suggest you read the Bible if you haven't done it yet, or again if you did, and above all that the book of Zeccharia Sitchin - 'The Twelveth Planet', like I said, for more detailes on this 'bogus story' I'm telling you. This is the connection to all as I know it. I maybe be a little blury sometimes, but it's enough for you to read those books so far, and you will be interested (and shocked :roll:) to read even more, trust me.

[DavidAlizée]

Sorry Ned. That to me, sounds like some college nerds, who have took the bible, misread, took key events and added some super alien conspiracy. Your sources are just books.. I have read many books, Holy Blood, Bloodline of Christ, Templar revelations, all claiming something different. Just so you know, i went to a Roman catholic school, we have read the bible cover to cover many time, i know the new testemant like the back of my hand, and i have read the old testiments also many times. I don't dispute that God was some kind of high evolved Alien, we know nothing about his extreme power, so everyone has their own view of God and heaven. I know, for fact, that Jesus Christ is the son of God, came to us through virgin Mary to save our sins. Again, all the porrof you provide is from a crazy russian that wrote a book.

I guess it all depends on what you believe. I grew up in a catholic school, so i am sure you can appreaciate the importance of my faith. With all due respect, and i mean this, not attacking you in anyway. I think that is rubbish above imo. Some people believe that kinda stuff, so be it. For me, my faith is in the catholic church and the bible, and i don't see anything that points to those crazy events. I have seen so many books trying to translate what the bible means about stars, planets, aliens.. this is just another book added to the list.

Can you please quote me some verses in the bible, that actually points to these things? I must be stupid, because im reading it now, and i don't see anything at all, that points to anything that i don't know already. So, please quote some.

[Ned]

Sorry Ned. That to me, sounds like some college nerds, who have took the bible, misread, took key events and added some super alien conspiracy. Your sources are just books.. I have read many books, Holy Blood, Bloodline of Christ, Templar revelations, all claiming something different. Just so you know, i went to a Roman catholic school, we have read the bible cover to cover many time, i know the new testemant like the back of my hand, and i have read the old testiments also many times. I don't dispute that God was some kind of high evolved Alien, we know nothing about his extreme power, so everyone has their own view of God and heaven. I know, for fact, that Jesus Christ is the son of God, came to us through virgin Mary to save our sins. Again, all the porrof you provide is from a crazy russian that wrote a book.

I guess it all depends on what you believe. I grew up in a catholic school, so i am sure you can appreaciate the importance of my faith. With all due respect, and i mean this, not attacking you in anyway. I think that is rubbish above imo. Some people believe that kinda stuff, so be it. For me, my faith is in the catholic church and the bible, and i don't see anything that points to those crazy events. I have seen so many books trying to translate what the bible means about stars, planets, aliens.. this is just another book added to the list.
Off course I respect your belief in God, as I believe too, but, you see, after reading not only Zeccharia's book, but many many more, I found out that believing in God for example is not such a bad thing (come to think of it, when I started reading these books I read I didn't believe in God at all, I was then a somewhat disturbed atheist). To me God is the Mighty and Holy Energy that created the Universe, not some god as a divine entity similar to us. Everything written in the Bible is the whole truth, and I must say we are all interpreting it differently. I read books so shocking, they offended all the great churches in the world, including The Catholic Church, and mine, The Orthodox Church. But on my analisys over them, they were mistaking something. I'm not saying the Bible, the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Koran, Talmud or any other occult book (thou shall not mistake the word occult with evil satanic, but with kryptic, secret symbolic book not in particular evil), they were telling the real truth as we diserve to know it. Stories about Jesus, Virgin Mary, Jahwe even, or Mohammed (from the islamic Koran), or Ahura Mazda (from persic mazdeism), Sidartha Gautama (from Buddhism), anything written about them was and it's still is true.
That russian 'maniac' is actually an expert occult scientist in Russia, with many books to his credit, and by saying that he is just a nuttcase, you really offended his work, I mean years and years of hard work gone down the drain because we are judging his belief. Trust me, he believes in God too, otherwise he wouldn't have wrote this books (including the one mentioned by me). Ofc the story I told you sounded somehow stupid or crazy even (to tell you the truth, when I read my reply to you, I laughed a little, at how it sounded), but hey, it's just my opinion.
Regarding to what I believe God is, you will be forced to say that I believe Virgin Mary or other characters in the Bible didn't existed, by my opinion. I think they really existed, they were real. If they weren't real, I don't think that we would be here today, like this.
So bottom line is, I'm not trying to offend anyone by what I told you. As far as I'm concerning, go on believing in God, I will to in my own way! So the studies you had so far weren't in vain, neither were mine! Everyone may feel free to say anything, if that is what they really believe.




I really can't remember all the words, David, and I don't have The Old Testament in my home, but I can say it was something about them comming from heaven on a cloud or something, and they mentioned something about lights on them, as I said I don't remember all, it was in the Book of Kings or something. Sorry, because I couldn't quote, I really don't know exactly all the words written there, and I don't have an Old Testament in my home (when I read it I borrowed it from a friend of mine, and a neighbour). I really have to ask him to give it to me again, for I really am interested now :D, after having these conversations.

[DavidAlizée]

Well, i don't expect you to believe in the Roman Catholic church. For i do know, the bible talks about virgin Mary, but the Orthodox church does not believe in the Imaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary. The Roman catholic church and the Orthodox church dissagress on key events, regarding the dates of Christmas and Easter. We differ in so many ways, we believe Jesus also passed on his wisdom and teachings through word of mouth, through the church. We also believe the bible is true ( regarding the NT ) however, not everything is true. the versions differ alot, but the general idea is there. The RC church has alot of different views, like.. We show Jesus on the cross, because we believe he did not die for nothing, he should be remembered, afterall, thats what he wants. He wants us to remember what he did for us. The Orthodox church, doesnt show him on the cross, and believe it is blasphamy. They also baptise by full emersion, as we Roman catholics sprinke water, because we believe that baptisim should not only be by water, but by the holy ghost. Like John did, he said in the bible " I can baptise you with water, but one will come who will baptise you with the holy spirit" that is why we RC believe it is so important to baptise with the holy spirit also, other churches do not.

So, your version of the bible might mean something different to you. As for the dead sea scrolls, i have read that book too, including tha latter from the temple which was found in the jars. The only thing that was interesting to me in the Dead sea scrolls mainly, was the details of the excavation on the temple. I am not a one to read a book and take it as gospel. Sure i have thought about other possiblities about God ect, but i can't deny one fact. The only way to get to God is to have faith in his son Jesus Christ. The Catholic church is so important even more so now, just in the days of Jesus, when Jesus built his first church. As well, the only church that can date back to the times of Jesus is the RC.

I don't think your story is insane, but i srongly dissagree with that story you told, about the book. You are entitled to believe whatever you wish, but it is very hard for me to explain why you need the catholic church in your life. I won't even try, believe whatever you wish and attend any church you like regarding Christian religion. As for other religions, i won't even entertain an argument.

Regarding the bible Ned, i often listen to the NT by King James online, many times.

The King James Bible
Narrated by Stephen Johnston
Old and New Testaments


http://www.audiotreasure.com/

scoll down for king James bible.

[Ned]

So here we are talking from terrorists attacks to Jesus Christ and The Holy Bible. :D
You are right David, my interpretation of the Bible is different then yours, and thanks for the link. :thumbup:

[DavidAlizée]

what better way to turn such an horrific and dreadful thread of hate, pain and suffering, into something so pure like Jesus Christ and the Holy Bible :mrgreen:

As for the links, your welcome.

[Ned]

what better way to turn such an horrific and dreadful thread of hate, pain and suffering, into something so pure like Jesus Christ and the Holy Bible :mrgreen:

As for the links, your welcome.
Yeah, that's it! Very beautifull indeed! :D

[DavidAlizée]

Just an off topic here, for anyone who wants it really. I know melo and orion will, this is a small clip from the solo, from the chior of the Christmas mass. This boy not only sings perfect, but as the serve to stand infront of millions across the world, and sing this. I admire that totally. Listen to "mother mild" that note hits the soul!

If anyone wants to see the full mass, let me know, it the the most Holy and pure mass i have ever seen. I can't put into words how good it was, to watch it on Christmas eve.

Enjoy,
http://s51.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2ROTJGG96P89Q0N0EHAGT47JRX

[engin turk]

I had written wrong number about Istanbul attacks.I have just learned that the number of losts is 61,I knew as 27.

27 people died just in HSBC attack,and 34 people died in English Embassy attack.

[Mr Bond]

Oh this is terrible not again. I'm not sure if this is the same people but its pretty sick if anyone is trying to copy what happpened. :cry:

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/050721/325/fnv29.html

Thankfully no one has been hurt or killed this time.

[DavidAlizée]

i caught a glimpse of the news today, i didnt know there were any explosions. I thought smoke bombs, wow. Shocked. I can't understand what they are trying to prove. They will be caught for sure, London is like fort nox at the moment. I would love to get my hands on one of them.

[fallenONE]

Seriously.........The extremists should be told that this is not martyrdom and they will not goto heaven by doing these acts........ :x

[Mr Bond]

:shock: Omg I can't believe what I've just found. This really freaked me out.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/tm_objectid%3D15748675&method%3Dfull&siteid%3D89488&headline%3Dthe-scent-of-terror--name_page.html

[DavidAlizée]

well, when they die doing El Qaeda's dirty work, when they arrive at the gates of Heaven, there will be no-one there.

Chris, it must feel strange living in the same town as the bombers, i live close to Leeds myself as you know.. but, is there alot of things changed? lots of cameras and armed Police on buses up there too?

[Mr Bond]

In MK? Yeah they've got armed police patrols at the railway station, which they haven't had before. I feel so sorry for the staff in those shops that sold him the perfume they must feel awful but they had no way of knowing.

[DavidAlizée]

Yeah, but at least now.. they can stop the easy th