A complicated Theology-related question concerning Alizée.

[Joseph]

Not to offend the non-religous crowd with my ramblings, thanks for reading though.

Alright, so I was pondering of starting up my faith again, as I have not really been to church in a long time. I prayed and such before I ate and at night too, to such saint's usually as Micheal... but it wasn't even like, serious. But then I realized maybe in Heaven I could spend my spirit-life with Alizée every day for eternity? Even though it might seem like a lie to many, it could all as well be possible for me. What a beautiful dream that would be, and although nigh-impossible in the real world, you would have a chance in death. Live the good life, have faith and trust in God, and I'm sure to go there, some say. But then a friend said, " You could well burn in Hell. You would be ignoring God, and making your bed for your own reasons." Hmmm... could this be true? I could be being selfish, I mean, I studied up on it , and one christian minister/ something like that said that Hell is not torture; it is merely where you go because you never had faith in God and that he would never hurt you for not loving him and that you would live what you did living, or maybe a mortal life... of course to an orthodox catholic (officially, I haven't studied up on the other denominations to find my own likeness.) this is rediculous sounding, but you take all opinons and then decide your own perception on them, I guess. Then would Hell be the place? I'd sooner wish to spend a life, or as many as possible , with Alizée then soar among the angels... But does that constitute a 'sinful aproach for selfish reasons'? Here is a question that maybe ya'll might know the answer too. To an added note I was always a 'good christian' and enjoyed that 'feeling' you get after church prior to Alizée.

1) Do you think that this is a selfish approach to your after-death? Do you believe that if I am good enough in this life, with faith also I may be able to have this granted to me? (please state your religon and denomination)

I'd also like to add that nothing before has made me not afraid of death. Truly, something powerful resides in all of this... I'd like your comments on this issue, thanks. I want to know if I'll have to go to Hell to be with my Goddess.
:cry:

[DMB]

I want to know if I'll have to go to Hell to be with my Goddess.


Bad news bro. You're going to Hell. But I'm sure it's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. :wink:

[haloraven]

........I'll try not to be too overly rude......but why say that DMB....thats by far the worst thing I've ever hurd someone say to another person, but I guess if you have that kind of out look on your life then by all means do so.

JOSEPH....dude.....for one as its been explained to me, heaven is YOUR personal paradise, meaning what you think as wonderful and beautiful in your physical life then so it will be in your afterlife......and no you wont go to hell, Ive told you this before....no faith is 100% right about anything....and the fact is you dont even have to have a religion to still have faith.....thats the whole point....its not what religion you are....its the fact that you have faith is what counts.

Nor is it selfish to want to be happy, you love something and have faith in it, and that in its self is the greatest thing, I believe what I want to believe...I dont need someone to tell me what to believe, hence why I dont have an actuall sect or religious name tag, I have faith in gods love for me and his plan for my life, so no matter what, I know I love him and his son...as well as I love Alizée he put her in my life for a reason, and I'll stand by my faith and my love for Lili untill the day I die.

[Snatcher42]

Hmm, I can't really answer your questions Joseph... I guess they are the type of thing that everyone must answer for themselves. All I can say is that you have touched upon one of the reasons why I am not a religious person myself:

When I do something good, or just, or right I don't want to do so with thoughts of punishment or rewards in the after-life. I don't want to do good for God, I want to do it for it's own sake: Because it's the right thing, intrinsically, without anyone (or anything) telling me that it is so.

Likewise, when I make a mistake, or do ill - I want that burden to be on my head, without thoughts of justice after I am dead. And I want to atone for those sins not for the sake of any higher power, but for the sake of humanity... because the only way we can hope for anything better as a species is if people do take this burden upon themselves to live good lives.

I owe it to the human race, and I owe it to myself. No one else.

[Banana357]

What you're saying is that you want to have faith in God so that he would reward you with a positive afterlife. This is an incredibly selfish belief; you're exploiting God's mercy and kindness with a facade of faith so that in the end you can find Alizee in heaven. This interpretation borders on heresy.

Besides, you call Alizee your Goddess which is a direct violation of God's First Commandment. Try rethinking this faith thing and keep Alizee out of the picture.

[haloraven]

That is a good point banana, trying to do good just because you think god is going to some how OWE you one...and reward you is not right...but rather if you do good and do the right thing because it makes you happy, and you glorify god while doing it, then thats another thing....but taking advantage of what banana said is true....its the wrong thing to do....so dont change your faith or start changing the way you act just so god will commend you in the end...but rather do it so you can inprove your life and warship him in your everyday.

though banana id have to say i think that joseph truly is using goddess not in religious terms...i dont think he would actually make a richous decision to warship her like christians do god...but rather uses that as a title.

[DavidAlizée]

What you're saying is that you want to have faith in God so that he would reward you with a positive afterlife. This is an incredibly selfish belief; you're exploiting God's mercy and kindness with a facade of faith so that in the end you can find Alizee in heaven. This interpretation borders on heresy.

rubbish. How can someone who wants to go to heaven, or meet Alizée in heaven be a selfish belief? It's what he wants... how can you say that this is wrong. I can't belive you have questioned his faith. This sentance above me is wrong in so many ways...

Besides, you call Alizee your Goddess which is a direct violation of God's First Commandment

If you mean "Thy shall only worship one God and no other" i don't think joseph means it like this.. He is only saying she is a goddess.. I might add, many people think an angel is a goddess. Or, a passed on family member. Nothing to indicate he is worshiping Alizée like a goddess ( religiosly )


Also Joseph, anyone is fit to go to heaven. If you want to go to see Alizée there, thats fine. If Alizée has made you found your faith.. so be it to meet her in heaven.

[Ayan]

Thank god, im an atheist.

But now going back to the original post of joseph - i'd say love is the most powerful feeling on earth. probably the most beautiful and strongest feeling that the humans are ever able to feel. i dont know what you feel for Alizée, only you know that. if you are in love with Her, then it is understandable that you want to be with Her.
However, i would not think about the afterlife. Your life has just only begun. It is a great feeling, to be in love. It is whats makes the life worth living. Cherish the feeling, cherish the moments you feel it. Dont think about death.
Noone knows what triggers love. You could meet a girl and be in love with her in no time. All it takes, is to meet the right one. Love can fade, people can fall in love many times during their lives.

[DMB]

........I'll try not to be too overly rude......but why say that DMB....thats by far the worst thing I've ever hurd someone say to another person

Chill out. Drink a beer. I was just kidding. Being an Atheist I sometimes forget how sensitive some people can be to the subject. I apologize if I offended anybody. No harm intended.

it is merely where you go because you never had faith in God

Well I don’t know much about Christianity being an Atheist but I think this is correct -> Hell would be a primarily Christian belief, and in Christianity you go to heaven if you accept Jesus. (Whether Jesus is god, or the son of god is debated among the different branches.) Therefore you can do whatever you want, ask God for forgiveness, accept Jesus as you savior and fly right into the arms of Saint Peter. Sounds like a pretty arrogant God if you ask me.
As far as that feeling like you’re sinning, that’s the whole point of Catholicism, man is eternally flawed. You’re supposed to feel that. You’re in the clear as long as you confess your “sins.”
Also. Dude you’re 15. She’s 20. She’s too old for you. Go d/l some pics of Hilary Duff. She’s more in your age group.

Anyways I made a similar post in a different Forum, it's kind of off topic but I'd like to state my point anyway...

Over the past couple of years I've questioned my beliefs. No, I don't think there's a God, but what about all those things that just go unexplained?

Why do you think that we should have all of the answers? Why is it not OK to just not know? Why does everyone always have to feel that they need to know the answers to every fucking thing that has ever happened in the history of the universe and how every thing on this planet works. For one person to know all that information is a ridiculous and impractical. There are always things we are not going to know and there is nothing wrong with that. What is wrong is instead of finding answers to those questions is copping out and deciding that “God must have done it”.

There is a "god". Whatever caused all this to be made, whether it was the Christian god, or two rocks rubbing together.

Many of my Christian friends try to prove the existence of a “supreme being” by saying that the big bang theory is flawed and therefore there is no scientific explanation for the beginning of the universe and similar statements. Well if you’re so concerned about the origins of the universe then become a scientist and try to find answers for your questions, or be content with just not knowing. Either way is fine. Don’t blame it on a God that is equally mystical and unexplained as your questions.

After searching for these answers if you come to the conclusion that God is not the only the best answer to your questions but the ONLY answer, then that’s great. I congratulate you. But don’t sit on your couch, decide that you can’t find the meaning to life and decide that God must be behind it. That just pisses me off.

[/rant]

I have yet to read a couple of the posts and I have an exam in 3 hours so I’ll add more later but if you read the whole post, props and thanks. 8)

[Greg (Polonais)]

1) Do you think that this is a selfish approach to your after-death? Do you believe that if I am good enough in this life, with faith also I may be able to have this granted to me? (please state your religon and denomination)


I'm a Catholic. Well, if you propose to live a good, pious life in order to be granted an after-life with Alizée, it is not so much a "selfish" as rather "commercial" attitude :lol: . If you should change your mind about Alizée, would you also drop your endevours to be a good man? :lol: And if Alizée should go to hell, would you like to follow her and suffer together? You must admit that this is rather absurd because it implies that your actual god is Alizée and the God is just a merchant you make a deal with.

When I do something good, or just, or right I don't want to do so with thoughts of punishment or rewards in the after-life. I don't want to do good for God, I want to do it for it's own sake: Because it's the right thing, intrinsically, without anyone (or anything) telling me that it is so.


I owe it to the human race, and I owe it to myself. No one else.


A real believer is somebody who loves God because he knows that God is love itself. Such a person does not trade with God. He follows God's will out of love. He does not do good to gain heaven or avoid hell. He tries to do good because he is convinced in his mind and feels in his heart that this is the only way he should live. Snatcher24, you say that you feel what's right and owe it to human race and yourself, not to a god. If you think about it, you will realise that the traditional norms of good behaviour in Western civilization, which still shape our ideas of good and evil, are in fact Christian.


its not what religion you are....its the fact that you have faith is what counts.

It's true that Jewish, Christian and Muslim attitutes to most fundamental moral issues are very similar, but that's just because all three are based on Ten Commandments. Even here, though, you will find important differences, which you certainly realise, eg. between "an eye for an eye" approach of traditional Judaism and the Christian mercy and forgiveness. All three agree with the commandment "Love your fellow men like yourself", but who are our "fellow men"? Only Christians believes that our "fellow men" are all human beings. Many people tend to think that all religions are almost the same. Not so. A Hinduist or a Bhuddist would tell you that a crippled beggar must have done some terrible things in his earlier incarnations, so his suffering is his own fault. What's more, you shouldn't help him too much, because he must suffer to fullfil his Kharma and be reborn as a member of a higher caste. It is a common misconception that e.g. charity, pity for the suffering, avoidance of revenge or forgiveness are "intrinsically" correct, obvious to everybody as desireable. Not at all. These are Christian values which you may not find in other religions. Our conscience is shaped by our environment and religion is an important part of it, because it shapes (or shaped) the culture, law and istitutions of a given civilisation.


JOSEPH....dude.....for one as its been explained to me, heaven is YOUR personal paradise, meaning what you think as wonderful and beautiful in your physical life then so it will be in your afterlife......


We tend to imagine heaven as a combination of things that make us happy on earth plus the absence of those that make us unhappy. You know, like the harem of 30 eternal virgins for each man, and so on :wink:. Would be nice, I don't deny, but would it make me or you happy for eternity? Here, on earth, we always miss something and even if we feel very happy for a while, we quickly get bored and look for something new. The heavenly happiness is as inconceivable as God himself.

However, i would not think about the afterlife. Your life has just only begun. It is a great feeling, to be in love. It is whats makes the life worth living. Cherish the feeling, cherish the moments you feel it. Dont think about death.

I cannot agree. Remembering about death is the main condition of a good life. We commit many shameful acts in our lives just because we forget that we are going to die. To a believer it is obvious. But even non-believers wouldn't do certain things if they considered how they would be remembered by those who remain. When I was 15, I never thought seriously about my death. As we grow older, we become aware that it is closer than we ever thought. That thought, however, is not an obstacle but help to a good life.

Now Joseph, going back to your point, I also hope to meet Alizée in heaven. I sincerely pray for her to attain heaven. I trust in God's mercy to get there as well.

[Greg (Polonais)]

Well I don’t know much about Christianity being an Atheist but I think this is correct -> Hell would be a primarily Christian belief, and in Christianity you go to heaven if you accept Jesus. (Whether Jesus is god, or the son of god is debated among the different branches.) Therefore you can do whatever you want, ask God for forgiveness, accept Jesus as you savior and fly right into the arms of Saint Peter. Sounds like a pretty arrogant God if you ask me.
As far as that feeling like you’re sinning, that’s the whole point of Catholicism, man is eternally flawed. You’re supposed to feel that. You’re in the clear as long as you confess your “sins.”


No, you really don't know much about Christianity. Your facts are wrong. I could explain but it wouldn't help. One day something may happen in your life that will make you want to find out what it's really like. I hope so.

[Snatcher42]

When I do something good, or just, or right I don't want to do so with thoughts of punishment or rewards in the after-life. I don't want to do good for God, I want to do it for it's own sake: Because it's the right thing, intrinsically, without anyone (or anything) telling me that it is so.


I owe it to the human race, and I owe it to myself. No one else.


A real believer is somebody who loves God because he knows that God is love itself. Such a person does not trade with God. He follows God's will out of love. He does not do good to gain heaven or avoid hell. He tries to do good because he is convinced in his mind and feels in his heart that this is the only way he should live. Snatcher24, you say that you feel what's right and owe it to human race and yourself, not to a god. If you think about it, you will realise that the traditional norms of good behaviour in Western civilization, which still shape our ideas of good and evil, are in fact Christian.

Well, I learned my set of morals from my parents, who in tern learned it from theirs, etc etc... and we are a Jewish family dating as far back as can be recorded. So, if anything, I consider my ideas of good and evil to be based on Judaism (granted, that makes them overlap a great deal with Christian morals and ideology). Point being, I'm not an atheist and I actually have not yet decided what I truly believe in terms of God and religion. I just try not to make that part of my conscious life, guiding my behavior.

[Greg (Polonais)]

Well, I learned my set of morals from my parents, who in tern learned it from theirs, etc etc... and we are a Jewish family dating as far back as can be recorded. So, if anything, I consider my ideas of good and evil to be based on Judaism (granted, that makes them overlap a great deal with Christian morals and ideology).

That's exactly what I meant. Our value judgements are conditioned by the environment where we have been raised and where we live, even if we consciously rebel against it. I could have just as well said that the Western civilization is based on Judeo-Christian principles. I just assumed it as obvious that Christianity is rooted in Judaism.

I just try not to make that part of my conscious life, guiding my behavior.

What it ammounts to is that you're guided by the morals of your fathers uncosciously but you don't won't to follow them consciously. But why not, if your ideas of good and evil are based precisely on these morals? Do you intend to work out a different set of morals, if you come to the conclusion that God does not exist? Would you have the same certainty of seeing the difference between good and evil with another set of morals?

[Snatcher42]

No, but given that these are human constructs, I don't feel the need to think about God or religion in my every day actions. Seems simple enough - I'm not saying you're wrong in anyway, it's just something I decide not to think about.

It also seems like you are saying that if one follows and believes in the values of society, then the only non-hypocritical thing to do would be to also believe in God and religion. I don't agree that you can say that, even if they are culturally and historically connected. I believe in a set of morals. I don't know if I believe in God (at this point in life, I lean toward "no", but that may just be youth speaking). So I leave the later out of the former.
the difference between good and evil with another set of morals
On the whole "good and evil" thing, I actually lean more toward an eastern yin/yang philosophy (in that they cannot be separate, as they define each other)... but even that doesn't usually enter the equation in determining my behavior.

When I contemplate things on my own, I do have a spiritual side - but when I go out into the world, I like to keep things secular: thought and action alike. Just a personal preference.

[Greg (Polonais)]

It also seems like you are saying that if one follows and believes in the values of society, then the only non-hypocritical thing to do would be to also believe in God and religion.

Not quite. Earlier, when pointing out the connection between the two, I was trying to prove that what people sometimes consider to be "the intrinsically right things ", independent of any specific religion, is in fact based on the religious background of their culture, and might be judged differently by a person from a different cultural and religious background. Now I see we agree on this point.

I asked why you consciously distance yourself from the religion of your parents even though you unconsciously share their morals because I was curious. One needs some strong reasons for it, I suppose. But you don't have to answer. It was a very personal question.

Of course I know it is possible to follow a set of morals prescribed by a specific religion without being religious. Some people do it out of habit, which is fairly common. Some others may do it consciously, on purely rational grounds - they think that these morals are worth keeping because they work. This is less common, however since a person who believes that religion is just a human costruct will easily find a myriad of seemingly rational excuses to depart from its morals (As a matter of fact, even believers are tempted to do so :wink: )


On the whole "good and evil" thing, I actually lean more toward an eastern yin/yang philosophy (in that they cannot be separate, as they define each other)...

The belief that there must be a necessary equilibrium between the "good" and "evil" means that "good" is not really good and "evil" is not really evil. There have been several Christian heresies of this sort. It is mostly known as Manicheism. Of course you know that it is also irreconcilable with Judaism (unless it should mean the cabbala and numerology) I'd really go for Judaism, but then again, it is not a question of a rational choice. Faith is a grace of God.

[Snatcher42]

Yeah, we are more or less in agreement I think.

Some others may do it consciously, on purely rational grounds - they think that these morals are worth keeping because they work.
That's pretty close to my view. My reference to religion as a human construct was more about its application to society over the years. Going further back, there may be truth behind it. The jury's still out for me (it may be forever).

I agree with much of that last paragraph, and I wouldn't attempt to reconcile it with Judaism. I'm a Jew in the cultural sense... religiously, as I said before, I have some spirituality but I'm mostly secular (as were my parents).

But enough about me. Anyone else care to help Joseph?

[jon]

I don't think the issue is Joseph's original question, I think that a lot of people here disagree on what heaven is. Pat says one approach that would seem to answer Joseph's question and DMB had a different approach that would answer his question. So I think the thing to do would be to ask Joseph what his veiw of heaven is and answer within his framework.

What I don't understand about the whole thing is, I thought heaven was not suppose to be physical pleasure. I thought it was some spiritual pleasure (whatever the word "spiritual" means). So then the answer according to that is that none of us will meet Alizée in heaven because it is impossible to "meet" people in heaven. But that's all on the condition that heaven is not physical, if it is (like in Pat's explanation) then I don't know...

[Joseph]

I'd like to thank you all for responding, truly something where people of all faiths, even atheist discuss together under one roof can be considered a good thing.

But, according to the History Channel in Judaism you aren't gifted for acting good, or penalized for being "sinful" , as everyone goes to a certain "hell" where everyone sleeps, eternally. I personally don't view this a good way to live after death...

Bannana, if I worshipped Alizée as my protector and savior, would I even be asking you about religon in itself? No. You have the perception wrong.

I think what my question here is will heaven be "greater things"? Will I be forced to "understand" that mortals mean nothing when compared to Heaven? And if I ever believed for a moment that spending a spirit life with Alizée in some cottage or the like is better than being with God up there would'nt God understand? That's the simplified question; would God understand? Would he grant it? Faith is not a question either; I never started to pray because of all of this; my mother always said how I lived (i was premature, in bad heart/lung underdevelioped condition) because God had "Plans" for me. I read the childrens bible (still a thick one, mind you) when I was 8, I really was interested in it all. What would heaven be like? These questions all seem like only time could answer them... which probably is best, I guess. And so many viewpoints; Religon seems so much dependent on what weve been upbrought to believe and the morals were taught to live by.

[DMB]

? I'd sooner wish to spend a life, or as many as possible , with Alizée then soar among the angels... To an added note I was always a 'good christian' and enjoyed that 'feeling' you get after church prior to Alizée. ? And if I ever believed for a moment that spending a spirit life with Alizée in some cottage or the like is better than being with God up there would'nt God understand? That's the simplified question; would God understand? Would he grant it?

I’m not sure that I understand your dilemma. Am I misunderstanding you because from the ^^ above sentences it seems that you feel that you have to choose between Alizee (if you truly love her) or God. There is nothing in Christianity that says that you can’t want and go after love. You can have a relationship with both God and Alizee (or the girl of your choice). There’s nothing like you have to choose one or another. If that were the case than all Christians would be torn with the same question.
Also, heaven is where you go after you die if you have accepted Jesus as your savior where you will have eternal bliss. What that bliss is .. well.. all speculation. Who can really say what will be there. All you can be sure of if you are a believer, is that you will be happy. If you are a true Christian, trust Jesus, and follow the ways of Christ, then you will have eternal happiness. That’s where the faith comes in. So don’t worry so much.

No, you really don't know much about Christianity. Your facts are wrong.
No they’re actually right.


However, if I were you I would be concerned about something else. A bond between two humans is encouraged in Christianity if it is completely wholesome. It is for this reason that I have to be skeptical about the love you have for Alizee. I’m assuming that you have not spent a great deal of time with her, so do you really love her, or her looks and the image she is portraying. That would lead to lust more than love. And that doesn’t settle well with Christianity.

Thanks for reading. 8)

[Greg (Polonais)]

No, you really don't know much about Christianity. Your facts are wrong.

No they’re actually right.


Ok, let's see:
Hell would be a primarily Christian belief
- No. You will find the same or similar beliefs in many religions. Perhaps you meant purgatory.

Whether Jesus is god, or the son of god is debated among the different branches
- You must be joking. What I call Christian churches are the Catholic church, the Eastern Orthodox church and the main denominations of the Protestant church. The latter has developed so many tiny splinter groups and sects, that it's difficult to say what they actually believe.

in Christianity you go to heaven if you accept Jesus
- That has long been a debated question but I think the present consesus, at least as far as Catholicism is concerned, is that everybody can be saved. After all, some people will never get to know Jesus for no fault of their own. So if they sincerely follow their conscience trying to the good the way they understand it, they will still be saved as Jesus died for everybody (that is something Kalvinist would disagree with).

As far as that feeling like you’re sinning, that’s the whole point of Catholicism, man is eternally flawed. You’re supposed to feel that.
- As a Catholic, I assure you it's not the whole point. But of course, the idea that human nature is imperfect and that we should be guided by our coscience, which also hurts after we've done something wrong, is an important part of Christianity (not just Catholicism) and probably also other religions. You would find similar ideas among ancient Greek philosophers. We can't seriously think about improving ourselves as human beings if we claim that there is no such thing as sin. If we do what we know is wrong, we must accept responsibility for it, and not look for excuses.

Therefore you can do whatever you want, ask God for forgiveness, accept Jesus as you savior and fly right into the arms of Saint Peter.
You’re in the clear as long as you confess your “sins.”


In Catholicism there are 5 conditions of a good confession: 1. thorough examination of your conscience 2. sincere regret for the sins 3. sincere intention of improvement 4. truthful confession of your since 5. atonement for the wrongs committed (trying to remedy, as far as possible, the evil we've done). As you can see it's not so simple. Besides, as to the "flying straight into the arms of St. Peter", there might happen to be a purgatory on the way.


However, if I were you I would be concerned about something else. A bond between two humans is encouraged in Christianity if it is completely wholesome. It is for this reason that I have to be skeptical about the love you have for Alizee. I’m assuming that you have not spent a great deal of time with her, so do you really love her, or her looks and the image she is portraying. That would lead to lust more than love. And that doesn’t settle well with Christianity.


I never said I love her in the way that you love somebody whom you intend to marry tomorrow. As you point out, I don't know enough of her. Actually, from what I know I suppose our temperaments and tastes might be incompatible. Still there are certain beautiful features in her character and behaviour that won my heart. Of course I am also strongly attracted to her physically, which is only natural if you look at her :D But lust is an altogether different thing. I believe that most serious fans in this forum really love Alizée, that is want her good, rather that lust for her body.


I’m not sure that I understand your dilemma. Am I misunderstanding you because from the ^^ above sentences it seems that you feel that you have to choose between Alizee (if you truly love her) or God. There is nothing in Christianity that says that you can’t want and go after love. You can have a relationship with both God and Alizee (or the girl of your choice). There’s nothing like you have to choose one or another. If that were the case than all Christians would be torn with the same question.
Also, heaven is where you go after you die if you have accepted Jesus as your savior where you will have eternal bliss. What that bliss is .. well.. all speculation. Who can really say what will be there. All you can be sure of if you are a believer, is that you will be happy. If you are a true Christian, trust Jesus, and follow the ways of Christ, then you will have eternal happiness. That’s where the faith comes in. So don’t worry so much.


That's right.

[Manu]

I'd rather try to meet her in life, Joseph. Nobody has come back to tell us what we'll find after death, you know.

[Joseph]

That's where religon and fauth comes in, Manu.

:/

I don't think we'll ever know either, which is why some questions are just left unanswered. Maybe there better that way? Who knows.

[Icyhot]

Not to rock the boat even though i probably will is that the feeling you may feel for her may not be true.You really have to think about it.Would you be attracted to this person if the couldn't sing or dance or looked a certain way but had the same personality.In this case i may have to disagree with myself i know how stupid that sounds.She does have a spunky attitude which i like but not really athletic but still petite is good.On the case of god i see nothing wrong with it.What happens when a person who remarried after a spouse died passes away?Who knows its confusing but in the end if your a good person in life you are rewarded in death. I need to write shorter replies though :?

[Joseph]

ahaaha, no well said. And that is a hard issue, if someone should remarry... I don't understand why people do that, only to fill in a gap with someone who can never fil the gap with :cry: